Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Iskander · 01-28-2012, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvduv

Author Pawel Maciejko wrote a very interesting book recently called The Mixed Multitude on Jacob Frank and the Frankists.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iskander

Words can be made to mean anything people in authority choose them to mean. Rabbis are such people in authority.

Dan Cohn-Sherbok says this of the Shabatean Movement and of Jacob Frank:

Shabbatai declared that he was the Anointed of the God of Jacob .This action evoked a hysterical response—a number of Jews fell into trances and had visions of him on a royal throne crowned as king of Israel.

During his stay in Istanbul he was imprisoned but the prison became a messianic court: pilgrims from all over visited him in prison to join in messianic rituals and ascetic activities.

Eventually the Turks gave him the choice between conversion to Islam or death. He chose conversion and the name of Mehemet Effendi.

Many of his followers remained faithful to him, excusing his conversion or denying that he had converted to Islam—they said it was a phantom who had taken on his appearance, the messiah himself had ascended to haven

The followers that excused his apostasy argued on the basis of Lurianic kabbalah that there were two kind of divine light...

A number of groups continued in their belief that Shabbatai was the Messiah including a sect, the ‘dissidents’(Doenmeh), which professed Islam publicly , but nevertheless adhered to their own traditions.

Marrying among themselves, they eventually divided into sub-groups which violated Jewish sexual laws and asserted the divinity of Shabbatai and their leader Baruchia Russo.

In the eighteenth century the most important Shabbatean sect was led by Jacob Frank (1726-1791) (who was influenced by the Doenmeh in Turkey. Believing himself to be the incarnation of Shabbatai, Frank announced that he was the second person of the Trinity.

Eventually Frank and his disciples were baptized

Cohn-Sherbok does not mention Isaiah 21.11 in his book, Judaism

This summary of the book says:

Quote:

At the request of the local rabbis, Polish authorities arrested the participants. Jewish authorities contacted the bishop in whose diocese the service had taken place and argued that since the rites of Frank's followers involved the practice of magic and immoral conduct, both Jews and Christians should condemn them and burn them at the stake

http://www.upenn.edu/pennpress/book/14870.html

Duvduv · 01-28-2012, 05:38 PM

Yes, I have. I think it's pretty good. He's been studying this subject for a long time. Unlike the Frankists, the Donmeh sects have not disappeared, and continue to exist very secretively in Turkey. Many have become secularized but many still retain Jewish-Sabbatian beliefs about Shabtai Zvi or his "incarnations" in Yaakov Filosof his brother in law (Yakovlis), or in Beruchiah Russo (Konyosos) or no one {Kapandjis).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iskander

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvduv

Author Pawel Maciejko wrote a very interesting book recently called The Mixed Multitude on Jacob Frank and the Frankists.

Have you read it?

Iskander · 01-28-2012, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvduv

Yes, I have. I think it's pretty good. He's been studying this subject for a long time. Unlike the Frankists, the Donmeh sects have not disappeared, and continue to exist very secretively in Turkey. Many have become secularized but many still retain Jewish-Sabbatian beliefs about Shabtai Zvi or his "incarnations" in Yaakov Filosof his brother in law (Yakovlis), or in Beruchiah Russo (Konyosos) or no one {Kapandjis).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iskander

Have you read it?

Thank you very much,

This reviewer said this:

Amazon review (or via: amazon.co.uk)

“An Attempt to Rehabilitate a Scoundrel, May 10, 2011

This review is from: The Mixed Multitude: Jacob Frank and the Frankist Movement, 1755-1816 (Jewish Culture and Contexts) (Hardcover)

Well-researched, but egregious misuse of scholarly tools and archival sources to rehabilitate a scoundrel. Jacob Frank, who manipulated his followers for his own gratification and repeatedly changed religions to save his hide, is depicted here as a utopian religious syncretist with "highly original teachings" (179). Or as a victim. The mass conversion to Catholicism in 1759 occurred because "the unprecedented alliance of the Catholic clergy and the rabbinate drove Frank and his Polish followers into a corner and left them no other option than to convert to Chrstianity" (161)!

Their use of the blood libel against the Jewish community in the process is harder to explain away, so Maciejko simply omits any mention of Jacob Frank himself during the affair, not even asking whether Frank endorsed or, more likely, instigated the terrible accusation (ch. 4).

He admits that Frank was a "charlatan," but redefines charlatanism as the cultivation of "mystery," omitting any mention of opportunism (220). Frank's exploitation of his own daughter Eve is misread as proto-feminism (178). In the end, Frank was nothing more than an opportunist who sought adulation, fortune, and aristocratic title, and succeeded. He was a shape-shifter, not the idealist victim this book makes him out to be.”

Did Frank instigate the use of the blood libel?

Duvduv · 01-28-2012, 06:16 PM

If I remember correctly, the idea of the blood libel did not originate with him because he was not in Kaminetz during the disputation but in Turkey. It originated with others. At that earlier period he was not yet the overall leader of all the Sabbatians in Poland. The leaders at that earlier time were Solomon Schorr and Yehuda Leib Krysa according to the book.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iskander

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvduv

Yes, I have. I think it's pretty good. He's been studying this subject for a long time. Unlike the Frankists, the Donmeh sects have not disappeared, and continue to exist very secretively in Turkey. Many have become secularized but many still retain Jewish-Sabbatian beliefs about Shabtai Zvi or his "incarnations" in Yaakov Filosof his brother in law (Yakovlis), or in Beruchiah Russo (Konyosos) or no one {Kapandjis).

Thank you very much,

This reviewer said this:

Amazon review (or via: amazon.co.uk)

“An Attempt to Rehabilitate a Scoundrel, May 10, 2011

This review is from: The Mixed Multitude: Jacob Frank and the Frankist Movement, 1755-1816 (Jewish Culture and Contexts) (Hardcover)

Well-researched, but egregious misuse of scholarly tools and archival sources to rehabilitate a scoundrel. Jacob Frank, who manipulated his followers for his own gratification and repeatedly changed religions to save his hide, is depicted here as a utopian religious syncretist with "highly original teachings" (179). Or as a victim. The mass conversion to Catholicism in 1759 occurred because "the unprecedented alliance of the Catholic clergy and the rabbinate drove Frank and his Polish followers into a corner and left them no other option than to convert to Chrstianity" (161)!

Their use of the blood libel against the Jewish community in the process is harder to explain away, so Maciejko simply omits any mention of Jacob Frank himself during the affair, not even asking whether Frank endorsed or, more likely, instigated the terrible accusation (ch. 4).

He admits that Frank was a "charlatan," but redefines charlatanism as the cultivation of "mystery," omitting any mention of opportunism (220). Frank's exploitation of his own daughter Eve is misread as proto-feminism (178). In the end, Frank was nothing more than an opportunist who sought adulation, fortune, and aristocratic title, and succeeded. He was a shape-shifter, not the idealist victim this book makes him out to be.”

Did Frank instigate the use of the blood libel?

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