Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The Dagda · 12-19-2009, 05:31 AM

Yeah The Gospels are a crock lets face it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

500 raised corpses? What is that from?

Jesus comes back to life breaking the laws of life and death so some Jews decide to get in on the act and the tombs start opening up. It's in The Gospels.

storytime · 12-19-2009, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

Quote:

Originally Posted by storytime

If one is a Christian historian then bias is evident I think.

There doesn't seem to be any Christian holding a theological degree that I can say is a historian. Instead, they be theologians, teachers of the myth, biased in their belief of the supernatural, the power beyond what a human is able to perform.

Jesus walks on water, but did he know how to swim?

Jesus raises to life a dead stinking corpse while some of his enemies, the Pharisees, as witnesses look on.

Jesus walks through walls and frightens his disciples, eats fish with them, then disappears out of their sight leaving the disciples to think -- WOW!, that was a really cool magic trick. Now how can we spread this magic around so that others will believe Jesus can do some terrific magic tricks.

Jesus turns water into wine. Had the Pharisees known how Jesus could have made them filthy rich in the winery business, they'd not have thought to kill him. They'd have slapped a label on his forehead and paraded him to Rome where the big money profits were.

The 500 or so corpses raised and running around Jerusalem would surely have caused at least one Pharisee to blow the whistle in Rome and to Caesar. Every single one of those living corpses would have been rounded up and taken to Rome for close observation, if not for doing some biological examinations on.

Just imagine, all those dead Jews rising up, walking around, never to die any more. Would the Romans have been scared shitless or what?

500 raised corpses? What is that from?

A most senseless proposition of course.

storytime · 12-19-2009, 05:58 AM

What does the Jesus story say about the authors? Poor writing skill in composition as they cherry-picked fragments from old testament stories?

Where did this "Christ" myth begin? Was it's origin in how some OT Jews began a teaching on how souls could fly? Other Jewish sages condeming that teaching but it spread in wishful thinking?

The Dagda · 12-19-2009, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by storytime

What does the Jesus story say about the authors? Poor writing skill in composition as they cherry-picked fragments from old testament stories?

Where did this "Christ" myth begin? Was it's origin in how some OT Jews began a teaching on how souls could fly? Other Jewish sages condeming that teaching but it spread in wishful thinking?

The prohecies of the stem of Jesse in the OT is its origin, self fulfilling prophecy though.

aa5874 · 12-19-2009, 06:21 AM

The HJ is a most SENSELESS proposition.

The massive and eternal problem for an HJer is to prove or establish within reason that the Jesus story must be true or is very likely to be true while at the same time rejecting the truthfulness of virtually every single event with respect to Jesus as found in the NT and Church writings.

Without any external historical sources for Jesus of the NT the HJer is doomed to fail in his pursuit of historicity.

If we examine any Gospel story of Jesus it is seen that virtually all the miracles of Jesus are known fiction or are implausible., however an HJer assumes that the miracles are embellishments.

Now, once it is claimed that an event was embellished and not total fiction some evidence or credible information MUST BE produced by the HJer for the non-embellished portion of the event.

An HJer cannot presently produce any credible external source for any event that he deems embellished.

The massive and eternal problem for the HJ can be seen when gMark is examined chapter by chapter.

In gMark 1.40-41, Jesus,[Holy Ghost-Man] healed a leper by simple talking to him. This story is blatant fiction. HJers simply cannot prove or establish that healing of the leper was embellished, they simply cannot establish that any leper was ever instantly healed in the 1st century.

Mark 1.40-41 can only be categorize as a legendary fable once HJers fail to produce credible historical information.

In gMark 2.3-11, a man with palsy or some kind of paralysis is immediately healed by Jesus again by simple talking to him. This is blatant fiction. HJers cannot establish that portions of this fable was embellished using any external historical sources.

The palsy story as presented in gMark is total fiction.

Mark 3.1-5, Jesus [Holy Ghost-Man] talks to a man with a withered hand and right away the man hand is made whole.

Again another blatant fiction story.

HJers cannot show or establish that a withered hand was healed instantly in the 1st century.

Mark 4.36-41, Jesus talks to a storm at sea and the sea and wind became calm.

Fiction again, and HJers cannot establish or show that a storm at sea was ever made calm by using mere words of command.

Mark 5.2-14, Jesus causes 2000 pigs to drown on the request of demons. Fiction after fiction. HJers cannot show that 2000 pigs were ever drowned in the 1st century because of demons.

In Mark 5. 25-42, Jesus brought a dead girl back to life with words. I don't know how the girl heard him. Fiction again. HJers cannot prove or establish that a girl was brought back to life in the 1st century with a speech.

Mark 6.37-43, Jesus feeds 5000 men with 5 loaves and 2 fish. Blatant fiction. HJers cannot show that 5000 men were fed with 5 loaves and 2 fish in the 1st century.

Mark 6.46-50, Jesus [Holy Ghost-Man] walks on water. This is total fiction. HJers cannot show that a man walked on water in the 1st century.

Mark 7.32-37, Jesus heals the deaf with a speech impediment by using spit. All fiction.
HJers cannot prove any one was healed by spit and a simple touch in the 1st century.

Mark 8.14-19, Jesus feeds 4000 men with a little fish and bread. Fiction. HJers cannot show that 4000 men were fed in the 1st century.

Mark 8.23-29, Jesus heals a blind man with spit again. Blatant fiction. HJers cannot show that a blind man was healed by using spit in 1st century.

Mark 9.2, Jesus transfigures. Glorious fiction. HJers cannot prove that a man transfigured in the 1st century.

Mark 9.17-27, Jesus talks to dumb man and he recovers immediately. Fiction. HJers cannot show or establish that a dumb man was healed by using mere words in the 1st century.

Mark 10.46-52, again Jesus heals a blind man with a speech. Fiction, Fiction, Fiction.
HJers cannot prove that any blind man was healed by a speech in the 1st century.

In Mark 11.12-21, Jesus curses a tree and it dies from the root. Fiction after fiction.
HJers cannot show or prove that a tree was cursed and did die in the 1st century.

Mark 16.6, the most absurd and fictitious event. Jesus rose from the dead. HJers cannot prove that a man did rise from the dead in the 1st century.

So virtually the whole of gMark, from beginning to end, is KNOWN FICTION and HJers have no way of proving, establishing or showing that any miracle happened wholly or in part.

HJers have nothing but their imagination. The HJ is doomed.

The HJ is a most SENSELESS proposition since virtually the whole Jesus story in gMark is KNOWN FICTION.

Larkin31 · 12-19-2009, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

Yeah The Gospels are a crock lets face it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

500 raised corpses? What is that from?

Jesus comes back to life breaking the laws of life and death so some Jews decide to get in on the act and the tombs start opening up. It's in The Gospels.

Really? I don't remember that at all....

The Dagda · 12-19-2009, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

Yeah The Gospels are a crock lets face it.

Jesus comes back to life breaking the laws of life and death so some Jews decide to get in on the act and the tombs start opening up. It's in The Gospels.

Really? I don't remember that at all....

I think it's at the end of John before Jesus starts haunting the disciples.

Larkin31 · 12-19-2009, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

Really? I don't remember that at all....

I think it's at the end of John before Jesus starts haunting the disciples.

I can't find it there. It's ok. I'll look elsewhere on my own...

Matthew 27:52. You are exactly right. Thanks.

The Dagda · 12-19-2009, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

I think it's at the end of John before Jesus starts haunting the disciples.

I can't find it there. It's ok. I'll look elsewhere on my own...

Just type in zombie Jesus gospels into google.

Larkin31 · 12-19-2009, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

I can't find it there. It's ok. I'll look elsewhere on my own...

Just type in zombie Jesus gospels into google.

HAHA

see above

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12-19-2009, 05:58 AM	#333
storytime Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: USA Posts: 2,608	What does the Jesus story say about the authors? Poor writing skill in composition as they cherry-picked fragments from old testament stories? Where did this "Christ" myth begin? Was it's origin in how some OT Jews began a teaching on how souls could fly? Other Jewish sages condeming that teaching but it spread in wishful thinking?

12-19-2009, 06:21 AM	#335
aa5874 Contributor Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: the fringe of the caribbean Posts: 18,988	The HJ is a most SENSELESS proposition. The massive and eternal problem for an HJer is to prove or establish within reason that the Jesus story must be true or is very likely to be true while at the same time rejecting the truthfulness of virtually every single event with respect to Jesus as found in the NT and Church writings. Without any external historical sources for Jesus of the NT the HJer is doomed to fail in his pursuit of historicity. If we examine any Gospel story of Jesus it is seen that virtually all the miracles of Jesus are known fiction or are implausible., however an HJer assumes that the miracles are embellishments. Now, once it is claimed that an event was embellished and not total fiction some evidence or credible information MUST BE produced by the HJer for the non-embellished portion of the event. An HJer cannot presently produce any credible external source for any event that he deems embellished. The massive and eternal problem for the HJ can be seen when gMark is examined chapter by chapter. In gMark 1.40-41, Jesus,[Holy Ghost-Man] healed a leper by simple talking to him. This story is blatant fiction. HJers simply cannot prove or establish that healing of the leper was embellished, they simply cannot establish that any leper was ever instantly healed in the 1st century. Mark 1.40-41 can only be categorize as a legendary fable once HJers fail to produce credible historical information. In gMark 2.3-11, a man with palsy or some kind of paralysis is immediately healed by Jesus again by simple talking to him. This is blatant fiction. HJers cannot establish that portions of this fable was embellished using any external historical sources. The palsy story as presented in gMark is total fiction. Mark 3.1-5, Jesus [Holy Ghost-Man] talks to a man with a withered hand and right away the man hand is made whole. Again another blatant fiction story. HJers cannot show or establish that a withered hand was healed instantly in the 1st century. Mark 4.36-41, Jesus talks to a storm at sea and the sea and wind became calm. Fiction again, and HJers cannot establish or show that a storm at sea was ever made calm by using mere words of command. Mark 5.2-14, Jesus causes 2000 pigs to drown on the request of demons. Fiction after fiction. HJers cannot show that 2000 pigs were ever drowned in the 1st century because of demons. In Mark 5. 25-42, Jesus brought a dead girl back to life with words. I don't know how the girl heard him. Fiction again. HJers cannot prove or establish that a girl was brought back to life in the 1st century with a speech. Mark 6.37-43, Jesus feeds 5000 men with 5 loaves and 2 fish. Blatant fiction. HJers cannot show that 5000 men were fed with 5 loaves and 2 fish in the 1st century. Mark 6.46-50, Jesus [Holy Ghost-Man] walks on water. This is total fiction. HJers cannot show that a man walked on water in the 1st century. Mark 7.32-37, Jesus heals the deaf with a speech impediment by using spit. All fiction. HJers cannot prove any one was healed by spit and a simple touch in the 1st century. Mark 8.14-19, Jesus feeds 4000 men with a little fish and bread. Fiction. HJers cannot show that 4000 men were fed in the 1st century. Mark 8.23-29, Jesus heals a blind man with spit again. Blatant fiction. HJers cannot show that a blind man was healed by using spit in 1st century. Mark 9.2, Jesus transfigures. Glorious fiction. HJers cannot prove that a man transfigured in the 1st century. Mark 9.17-27, Jesus talks to dumb man and he recovers immediately. Fiction. HJers cannot show or establish that a dumb man was healed by using mere words in the 1st century. Mark 10.46-52, again Jesus heals a blind man with a speech. Fiction, Fiction, Fiction. HJers cannot prove that any blind man was healed by a speech in the 1st century. In Mark 11.12-21, Jesus curses a tree and it dies from the root. Fiction after fiction. HJers cannot show or prove that a tree was cursed and did die in the 1st century. Mark 16.6, the most absurd and fictitious event. Jesus rose from the dead. HJers cannot prove that a man did rise from the dead in the 1st century. So virtually the whole of gMark, from beginning to end, is KNOWN FICTION and HJers have no way of proving, establishing or showing that any miracle happened wholly or in part. HJers have nothing but their imagination. The HJ is doomed. The HJ is a most SENSELESS proposition since virtually the whole Jesus story in gMark is KNOWN FICTION.

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