Roger Pearse

The Academica Belgica have written back to say that they can't find any more of Della Vida's translation. I fear the last couple of pages are gone for good.

I have today written to the Mingana library offering them $50 for print-offs of the whole Ms. 142. They seem rather bureaucratic and slow, so this may take a while.

My attempts to locate the archives of Della Vida, possibly at the University of Rome where he taught, went unanswered. Does anyone have fluent Italian, and fancy having a pop?

andrewcriddle

There is the Secret of Secrets book a text on astrology and astral magic and other things in the form of Aristotle's teaching of Alexander
http://www.colourcountry.net/secretum/

Possibly Zoroaster is involved as the reputed author of the (pseudo) Chaldean Oracles.

Andrew Criddle

Roger Pearse

I have heard again from the Academia Belgica, who sent me also a letter received by Cumont, which refers to *another* Mingana manuscript containing the same phrase.

Andrew: where was this posthumous article again, then, if not in "Mithraic Studies"?

Here is a picture of the note, tucked inside own Cumont's offprint of the RA article. I cannot read Cumont's scribble, but the reference to "the book of elements" in Ms. Mingana 481 is clear enough.



And here is the full-size image.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Roger Pearse

Sir,

After reading the fine article in the Revue Archaeologique which you had the great kindness to send me, for which I thank you very much, I dug out some photocopies of some Mingana manuscripts which I had made in 1938, and I found a letter of yours of 3rd December 1938 where, concerning Mingana Ms. 142, you already outlined the parallel with the famous text of Justin.

Please permit me two observations:

1. One relates to the translation (of Mr. Levi della Vida) quoted in your note 1 on page 194: with the text before me, I think that it should be translated:

"After some time, the people believed that they were resurrected, and that they were found in their houses."

The text does not say 'house of fire' as it says it in the phrase where the expression is, quite rightly, translated by 'pyree'. This signifies, I think, that, by a magical operation they were made to come back to them. However this is of no importance... No more important is the detail that numbered the folios of the manuscript 158b and 159a instead of 58b and 59a, where, for the first letter of the name of the king contemporary with Zardasht, a 'c' has been substituted for the ' (ayin).

2. The second relates to another Karshuni text of the Mingana collection, Ms. Syr. 481, which contains a parallel text which I translate for you here:

folio 225b lines 17-20: "And Zardusht the Mage says, in the Book of the Elements of the World, to his disciples: He that eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I remain in him."

This mention of the book of "stoixeia" is more suggestive than the mysterious "z b h r" of manuscript 142, but may help explain the latter.

The Greek word passed into Syriac and into Arabic (istaqis or istuqus) and remains in the language of classical philosophy down to Avicenna. It is very interesting to see these texts of such late origin throw some light on the archaeology of Mithraic monuments and connect them to the literary tradition of Hellenised mages. I hope, this winter, to go to Rome and to have the opportunity to visit the Mithraea of which you speak in your article of the Academie des Inscriptions.

In offering you my thoughts here once again, I hope that you find here, Sir, assurance of my most profound respect.

Fr. P. J. de Menasce O. P.
----

Can anyone read the scribble? I'll have to take down that image shortly, as it isn't mine, but I'd welcome suggestions.

Chris Weimer

And I thought my handwriting was terrible! I can't make out a whole lot, partially because my French isn't so good (at all), I'll admit, but I can barely recognize the Greek even. Looks like a sou is in there. Is there word on the seventh line mystique? (du?) banquet et qu' on etablit sous un relation mystique?

Roger Pearse

That's more than I could manage! But I agree with all that. The word before your first du must be 'Mithraiques', I think -- do we read on line 2: 'sous figures dans les representations Mithraiques'?

andrewcriddle

It is pps 151-214 in Mithraic Studies I (the R L Gordon article immediately follows it) It has the title 'The Dura Mithraeum' by Franz Cumont translated and edited by E D Francis (I have the book open in front of me as I write)

The relevant portion is p 181 particularly foot note 171 Andrew Criddle

andrewcriddle

Although Zoroaster did indeed have various astrological/mystical/gnostic works falsely attributed to him, the attribution of the (pseudo) Chaldean Oracles to Zoroaster is (on reflection) probably too late to be relevant.

It is first solidly witnessed by Pletho in the last years of Christian Byzantium and was accepted by Renaissance Hermetists but it cannot be shown to have benn held by the Arabs.

Andrew Criddle

Roger Pearse

Interesting. Didn't Porphyry refute the authorship of some book ascribed to Zoroaster? It's not in Eunapius, tho, so I'm not sure how I know this.

spin

Some more words from the scribble...

... que precisement ?ces? ?elements?
du banquet et qu un etablis**** un relation mystique ?entre? les trouve** ...

et le banquet sa ?crei?


spin