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Old 03-03-2012, 06:15 AM   #11
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Jesus healed the ear. No problem.

And they had to arrest him at night because he was preaching to crowds during the day who would have rioted.

These are the same crowds that later called for his death.
Ahh, you must have stayed awake in Sunday School!
Constantine had to believe that Malchus was completely healed, anyway.
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Old 03-03-2012, 07:10 AM   #12
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1. Why was Peter not arrested after cutting a dude's ear off? They were already arresting Jesus for less than that. Is it at all historically plausible that anyone could have attacked a "servant of the High Priest" with a sword while defending a fugitive insurgent that the servant had brought Temple guards to arrest and not been arrested (if not killed on the spot)?
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"Mark" is the original here and does not say "Peter".

http://biblos.com/mark/14-47.htm

Strong's Transliteration Greek English Morphology
1520 [e] heis εἷς one Adj-NMS
1161 [e] de δέ moreover, Conj
5100 [e] tis τις a certain IPro-NMS
3588 [e] tōn τῶν of those Art-GMP
3936 [e] parestēkotōn παρεστηκότων standing by, V-RPA-GMP
4685 [e] spasamenos σπασάμενος having drawn V-APM-NMS
3588 [e] tēn τὴν the Art-AFS
3162 [e] machairan μάχαιραν sword, N-AFS
3817 [e] epaisen ἔπαισεν struck V-AIA-3S
3588 [e] ton τὸν the Art-AMS
1401 [e] doulon δοῦλον servant N-AMS
3588 [e] tou τοῦ of the Art-GMS
749 [e] archiereōs ἀρχιερέως high priest, N-GMS
2532 [e] kai καὶ and Conj
851 [e] apheilen ἀφεῖλεν cut off V-AIA-3S
846 [e] autou αὐτοῦ of him PPro-GM3S
3588 [e] to τὸ the Art-ANS
5621 [e] ōtarion ὠτάριον ear. N-ANS

As you know "Mark" has a primary theme of discrediting the supposed historical witness disciples. Here he is going for the symbolic connection of when the disciples abandon Jesus they are cut off from him. They go in different directions, so to speak. The supposed literal mess left over is secondary.

If you must try to make it plausible less absurd, you can reduce the fiction meter a level or two by reversing expectations and having the striker be a member of the arresting party and the victim being with Jesus but not "with him". This solves more problems than it creates not to mention what's so hard to believe about an employee of a Priest hanging out in a Park at night known to be frequented by men.


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Old 03-03-2012, 07:38 AM   #13
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Jesus healed the ear. No problem.

And they had to arrest him at night because he was preaching to crowds during the day who would have rioted.

These are the same crowds that later called for his death.
Ahh, you must have stayed awake in Sunday School!
Constantine had to believe that Malchus was completely healed, anyway.
No way!!!! People of the Roman Empire had to believe what Constantine told them to believe or suffer the consequences.
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:10 AM   #14
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Jesus healed the ear. No problem.
Only Luke has this perhaps because he did not understand Mark's allusion to Isa 51:4 and Gal 4:21 in the verse. Note the casual appearance and anonymity of the assailant, and the seeming nonsequitur of the next verse (14:48), in which Jesus complains about the lawlessness of the arrest.

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Old 03-03-2012, 08:37 AM   #15
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Jesus healed the ear. No problem.
Only Luke has this
Only Luke was a doctor.
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:10 AM   #16
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Jesus healed the ear. No problem.
Only Luke has this
Only Luke was a doctor.
Who was Luke?? There is no person called Luke in gLuke and no person called Luke who was a doctor when the ear was severed.
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Old 03-03-2012, 10:00 AM   #17
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The healing of the ear is only in Luke, and is obviously not a realistic solution for me.

Putting things into more broad terms (and this is probably what I should have done in the first place), are there any decent HJ theories as to why Jesus' followers would not have been arrested with him. It's my understanding that the Romans customarily killed everybody involved with nascent insurgencies, not just the leader.
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Old 03-03-2012, 10:31 AM   #18
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Putting things into more broad terms (and this is probably what I should have done in the first place), are there any decent HJ theories as to why Jesus' followers would not have been arrested with him. It's my understanding that the Romans customarily killed everybody involved with nascent insurgencies, not just the leader.
Because they'd legged it into the trees. What else would you do, faced with a bunch of mean-looking guys in a dark wood, carrying torches, hammers, nails, and kissing strange blokes?

Jesus: "Where is everyone?"

Disciples vanishing into the undergrowth (faintly): "Right behind you, revered leader."

Centurion: "Grab everyone who looks suspicious."

Soldier: "Funny ... they've all gone..."
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Old 03-03-2012, 10:46 AM   #19
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The healing of the ear is only in Luke
As are a lot of other supernatural healings. It's what one expects of him, mentioning this, which was not germane to the dramatic story of the arrest, which is already packed with subtle meaning that few appreciate. Luke was particularly interested in outcomes for the poor, the outcast and the sick. It wasn't just professional interest, it was evidently a matter of basic human sympathy, for him, allied to an educated, professional desire to produce a complete and coherent account for professional people.

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Putting things into more broad terms (and this is probably what I should have done in the first place), are there any decent HJ theories as to why Jesus' followers would not have been arrested with him. It's my understanding that the Romans customarily killed everybody involved with nascent insurgencies, not just the leader.
That's true, they did, but they had no reason to suppose that Jesus and his party of ordinary artisans and associated women travelling round the country doing good, and urging non-violence, were insurgents! That this party survived for three years without suppression by twitchy Romans is witness to its apolitical, non-threatening nature.
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Old 03-03-2012, 10:55 AM   #20
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Just curious, Is there any thing written at this time outside of the bible? Anything to back it up?
It seems to me that people study the bible to prove the bible is right.

Just a 77 year old that hasn't read that obnoxious bible and wont. Where are the original texts that back it up?
There are none. The books mythical stories are the the only evidence for themselves.
Christianity has always wanted the world to drink their Kool-Aid without ever asking what's in it.
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