dogsgod

Yes, but what about this specific context, as in brother of the Lord. It can be taken to mean a spiritual or literal brother in English, but what about in Greek form?

Toto

It's all context - there is no linguistic basis for one meaning or the other.

aa5874

You need to demonstrate that Galatians 1.19 is in fact true and that they were written before the Fall of the Temple. You need to find a corroborative source for the Pauline writings.

In fiction stories characters may have brothers and mothers in Jerusalem or anywhere else in the world.

The father of Homer's Achilles was reported to be a real human king.

And further, the Pauline writer could have been an idiot, a madman, or a liar and still write Galatians 1.19.

Now, you cannot claim that gMatthew, gMark and Josephus resolved Galatians 1.19 when there is NOT ONE SINGLE REFERENCE to James the bishop of Jerusalem in those books unless you believe that there was only one person named James in the entire 1st century before the Fall of the Temple.


Again, Josephus, Matthew and Mark do not make a single reference to a bishop of Jerusalem who was the head of Jesus believers worshiping a man as a God.

There are only Questions and Forgeries in Josephus, gMatthew and gMark.

Look at the questions. The author of gMatthew asked three questions.

Mt 13:55 - The author of Gmark asked two questions.
Mr 6:3 - Neither the author of gMatthew or gMark answered their own questions.
It is not true at all that there are multiple attestations of Galatians 1.19, it is the complete reverse. There are MULTIPLE QUESTIONS

And Papias will make Galatians 1.19 more questionable.

This is from the fragments of Papias See http://www.newadvent.org

Papias makes it clear that the LORD'S AUNT was the mother of James bishop of Jerusalem.

And it is highly illogical to believe that information that is late is faulty when all corrections of any errors must be done late or after the erroneous information has been propagated.

It is just plain absurd to believe that a writing of antiquity is true based primarily on its chronology. Even today, the first story about any event may not be entirely true or filled with errors and may need LATER CORRECTIONS.

All Corrections must be done later. You yourself have made later corrections to your own post.

It is corroboration that is of utmost importance.
You need to figure out how to corroborate Galatians 1.19 since Papias did not.

judge

1.Do we have any examples where "brother of the lord" is non literal?

2.Do we have examples where "brother" means "fellow believer"?

aa5874

You need other external sources to resolve the supposed ambiguity.

It is simply a waste of time to use the very ambiguous passage to resolve itself.

There are other sources that have information about the Lord's aunt's and the sons of the Lord's aunt. You just cannot continuously ignore all the evidence.

The supposed Paul, Papias and Jerome are all part of the evidence or sources to help resolve the matter.

Papias corrected the Pauline writer and this correction by Papias seemed to have been still upheld by Jerome writing hundreds of years later.

Once the Church writers say James was not the brother of the their Lord and Saviour how in the world are you going to prove they are wrong?

dogsgod

1. This is the 64,000 dollar question. Is James, brother of the Lord, literal or not? In English it can be either, but what of Greek?

2. We have over a hundred examples throughout the epistles and Acts that can be taken to mean "fellow believer."

dogsgod

What? It's not an excellent question?

judge

No it is an excellent question. I just didnt want to get over-involved in the thread. The last discussion got a bit emotional and a moderator asked thta ppl calm down so I thought I would just be involved the minimum and still try to get to the evidence.

show_no_mercy

You just posted one in your Galatians quote.

Surely, the name "Ahijah" which literally means "brother of YHWH" doesn't mean literal brother.

ApostateAbe

No, don't misunderstand, I do think that "brothers of the Lord" in 1 Corithinians 9:5 means the human siblings of Jesus. Not that it is especially clear, but Paul seemed to be referring to a high-status group of men who were not the same as the group of apostles, and that would likely be the four brothers of Jesus. We don't have any other alternative available, except what is mere speculation. Galatians 1:19 uses the phrase to refer to a guy named James, a name reputed to be one of the four brothers of Jesus, and that should be seen as reinforcement.