aa5874

What?? Have not you read Galatians 4.4.??? Was your "Jebus" AlREADY a full grown man when he was made of a woman??

Galatians 4:4 KJV The Pauline writings are compatible with the Later Gospels.

Jesus was God's Own Son made of a woman who gave his Life for Remission of Sins and was Resurrected.

aa5874

Please, read the very FIRST paragraph of the OP.

Duvduv

I would like to throw in an alternative:

There was no 'Jesus Christ' nor any apostle Paul, nor any apostles, or any 'apostolic church' in the 1st century or before 70 CE, or likely before the middle of the 4th century.
.

aa5874

Where is the supporting evidence for your "Throw In"??? You constantly "throw in" things using your imagination.

Please, present your sources, your evidence, the written statements from apologetic and non-apologetics, the recovered dated manuscripts of antiquity.

In effect, you "throw in" nothing when you don't "throw in" supporting evidence.

Now, the History of the Jesus cult is extremely easy to deduce--a Piece of cake.

The Jesus story and cult started after the writings of Josephus or sometime in the 2nd century after an anonymous writing claimed the Jews Delivered up to be Killed the Son of their own God and that the very same Son of the God of the Jews will soon be coming back to destroy the Jews and others if they did NOT repent or believe the Son of God story.


Mark 8:31 KJV
Mark 14:62 KJV

Duvduv

I know you cling to the second centuey rhough the fact that there existed a regime only from the fourth century that had a vested interest in promoting the religion with its heresiologists should cause you pause, since no empirical external evidence exists for this mass movement before the fourth century.

Sheshbazzar

Then it follows that there was never any 1st century 'Paul' that ever persecuted a Christian church that did not even exist in the 1st century.

The accounts given in the book of Acts of The Apostles, and Galatians 4:4 are then nothing more than parts of a false and entirely fabricated church history.

Again given a 2nd century CE or latter origin of the 'Jesus the Son of God' tale, (and I am not disputing this) there is no way that 'Paul' persecuted any Christian church in the 1st century.
And no 'Paul' of the 1st century could have known of any baby Jebus story, which was not born (invented) until sometime in the 2nd century.

The church made up a bunch of crap on the fly, inventing a 'history' that never happened, with a invented messiah/christ, 'apostles' and 'Paul' that never existed, and managed to sell that steaming heap of mythical 'history' to the world as 'The New Testament'.

We are on the same page. My post was focused on the Church's motivations for fabricating 'The New Testament' and on how these wholly fictional stories came together.

aa5874

You are in complete error. There is evidence of the Jesus story BEFORE the 4th century.

Please, "throw in" some evidence from antiquity that the Jesus story and cult did not start before the 4th century.

I have already shown you the list of Recovered Dated NT manuscripts and there are stories of Jesus and letters under the name of Paul that have been dated to the 2nd-3rd century.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...stament_papyri

The Jesus story and cult started in the 2nd century with anonymous stories that the Jews Killed or caused the death of the Son their Own God and that the very same Son of the God of Jews is soon coming back as predicted in Hebrew Scripture.

Examine the evidence from antiquity. The Jesus story and cult started some time AFTER the writings of Josephus c 96-99 CE and BEFORE the Messianic ruler Simon Barchocheba c 131-133 CE.

Sinaiticus Mark 13Justin's First Apology XXXI

Duvduv

There is no evidence anywhere including the Talmud for this claim found in that Josephus text concerning Bar Kochba, and there is no sense building your whole assertion based on it. Josephus is also known for his myth about Massada. No one knows if there was someone named Josephus who wrote that text either in part or in total. And this Justin is a huge problem as well.

aa5874

There is no evidence of the Talmud in the writings of Suetonius, Tacitus, Justin Martyr, Theophilus of Antioch, Athenagoras, Aristides, Lucian, Tertullian, Hippolytus, Clement of Alexandria, Cassius Dio, Plutarch, Pliny the younger, Origen, Eusebius and many other writers.

No one today knows when the Talmud was actually composed. There are NO original manuscripts of the Talmud from the time of Josephus or later.

The Talmud is very problematic as a source of non-Jewish history.

There is no evidence that the Talmud support your claim that the Jesus story and cult started in the 4th century or later.

The Talmud does NOT mention the Nicene Creed and when it was introduced.

Duvduv

The talmudic and midrashic literature discusses many aspects of the Bar Kochba episode, as well as many other historical events. In case you didn't notice the Talmud recounts Jewish events, events involving Romans,
Canaanites, Samaritans, Babylonians, etc. IF there were anything involving "Christians" in relation to Bar Kochba in Judea it would have mentioned it, or at least the midrash would have.

However, there is total silence in all traditional Jewish literature about the existence of any Christians in Judea, including the midrashim and Jerusalem and Babylonia talmuds.