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Old 12-23-2010, 08:25 PM   #71
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As if the sun could actually stop! Sheesh.

Obviously the earth just stopped turning for while.
It doesn't matter who stopped if the light of common day stopped since that is what the message really is about. IOW, the movement is not what counts but the prevailing darkness is what was counted and that typically is the night on which Christ was born, as we call it.
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Old 12-23-2010, 10:42 PM   #72
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Does anyone know of similar stories about the sun stopping for a period of time in ancient Greek or Roman myths? It might help shed some light on what the story in Joshua means.

Herodotus writes in his histories:
http://classics.mit.edu/Herodotus/history.mb.txt
The sun, however, had within this period of time, on four several occasions, moved from his wonted course, twice rising where he now sets, and twice setting where he now rises.
The sun was a primary god for some; I wonder of Joshua describes a moment where the Hebrew god exercises authority over the sun, for theological purposes.
I documented similar stories, etc in post 60.

This was in response to a post by Olivia towards the beginning of the thread. My reply gives references to things she mentioned, such as the similar stories and Velikovsky.
The link to similar stories didn't provide references to original sources unfortunately. For example, the link quotes Riss to claim "Herodotus recounts that the priests of Egypt showed him their temple records, and that there he read a strange account of a day that was twice the natural length". I can't find such a comment by Herodotus, and there is no citation. Another quote, this time by Nelson: "Chinese history speaks of Yao, their king, declaring that in his reign the sun stood so long above the horizon that it was feared the world would have been set on fire; and fixes the reign of Yao at a given date, which corresponds with the age of Joshua the son of Nun..." Again, no citation to an ancient text. It would be good to see whether such quotes reflect actual ancient writings.
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Old 12-24-2010, 10:00 PM   #73
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I documented similar stories, etc in post 60.

This was in response to a post by Olivia towards the beginning of the thread. My reply gives references to things she mentioned, such as the similar stories and Velikovsky.
The link to similar stories didn't provide references to original sources unfortunately. For example, the link quotes Riss to claim "Herodotus recounts that the priests of Egypt showed him their temple records, and that there he read a strange acthe count of a day that was twice the natural length". I can't find such a comment by Herodotus, and there is no citation. Another quote, this time by Nelson: "Chinese history speaks of Yao, their king, declaring that in his reign the sun stood so long above the horizon that it was feared the world would have been set on fire; and fixes the reign of Yao at a given date, which corresponds with the age of Joshua the son of Nun..." Again, no citation to an ancient text. It would be good to see whether such quotes reflect actual ancient writings.
Whenever I bring up the Joshua sun-stopping story among fundamentalists, they immediately reference ancient sources from all over the world reporting that the sun stopped at some time in the past. I've had no better luck than you, except for a couple of cases where the legend is being told long after the recounters had contact with Christian missionaries.
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Old 12-25-2010, 04:01 PM   #74
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This is a different sun phenomenon, Pete. It's about the sun standing still in the sky, not hiding. Is there a connection?
In the beginning, the Joshua and the Jesus in the Greek stories are not explicitly named, but share the same abbreviated Greek nomina sacra code "ΙΣ".

Helios was not hiding, he just recalled his sunshine. The only way to do that as any 21st century physicist or Muse fan knows is within a supermassive black hole, where light returns to its sender. Hawking radiation emitted from the spacetime at the edges of the supermassive Black Helios Hole gave the impression that Helios was standing still. Of course Earth would be protected from the supermassive black sun spots by Gaia and a host of other terrestrial pantheons of gods, so us mortals could continue breathing and living and moving in Zeus.

In the thread Did the sun turn away from Jesus and recalling his rays make that day sunless? , stephan and andrew may be correct in ascribing the following quoted citation out of Athanasius to Athanasius and not Arius of Alexandria, as I had earlier presumed.

‘The heaven,’ as the Prophet says, ‘was astonished,
and the earth shuddered ’ at the transgression of the Law.

But the sun, with greater horror,
impatient of the bodily contumelies,
which the common Lord of all voluntarily endured for us,
turned away, and recalling his rays
made that day sunless.



The divine interest of the Roman Empire God Sol Invictus, Helios, is piqued by the death of "the common Lord" in the same manner as it had been piqued by the death of the Roman Emperor Julius Caesar, as described by Mark Anthony in the writings of Josephus. Perhaps here, the father of Christian orthodoxy Athanasius, appeals to the common authority of his 4th century pagan audience.

Stopping the sun and stopping the sunshine are highly related significant astrophysicial events shared by the bearer of the nomina sacra "ΙΣ" in the Greek language books which were preserved by the nation of Christians all the way to the fifth century, and far far beyond.
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Old 12-25-2010, 04:09 PM   #75
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The link to similar stories didn't provide references to original sources unfortunately. For example, the link quotes Riss to claim "Herodotus recounts that the priests of Egypt showed him their temple records, and that there he read a strange acthe count of a day that was twice the natural length". I can't find such a comment by Herodotus, and there is no citation. Another quote, this time by Nelson: "Chinese history speaks of Yao, their king, declaring that in his reign the sun stood so long above the horizon that it was feared the world would have been set on fire; and fixes the reign of Yao at a given date, which corresponds with the age of Joshua the son of Nun..." Again, no citation to an ancient text. It would be good to see whether such quotes reflect actual ancient writings.
Whenever I bring up the Joshua sun-stopping story among fundamentalists, they immediately reference ancient sources from all over the world reporting that the sun stopped at some time in the past. I've had no better luck than you, except for a couple of cases where the legend is being told long after the recounters had contact with Christian missionaries.
An Alphabetical List of the Emperors of China and of Their Year-Titles or Nien-Hao 年號
Author(s): J. L. J. F. Ezerman and B. A. J. Van Wettum
Source: T'oung Pao, Vol. 2, No. 5 (1891), pp. 357-389

The Chinese long day might have started during the reign of T'ang Ti Yao B C. 2357- 2256.

Sage Kings

Quote:
Several of the major Chinese legends take place during his reign, my favourite being the one about the ten suns and Yi the Archer.
China's Mid-Autumn Day
Author(s): Yang LemeiSource: Journal of Folklore Research, Vol. 43, No. 3 (Sep. - Dec., 2006), pp. 263-270

Quote:
The Myth of Chang'e
Once upon a time there suddenly appeared ten hot and red suns in the
sky, glaring down upon the world mercilessly. Fields were baked dry and
cracks appeared in them. Plants withered and fierce beasts ran wild,
placing the people in grave danger. To save the people from the calamity,
a brave hunter named Hou Yi rode his horse to the top of Mount Kunlun.
There he took out his bow and arrows, and took accurate aim. "Pfthth,
Pfthth." One by one, he shot down the nine surplus suns, ending the
severe drought.
Yao is over a thousand years before Joshua, and the story doesn't really account for the time zone change. It also is not exactly strikingly similar to Joshua.

Maybe there's a better fit somewhere, but this is the best I can come up with... nutty fucking xians.
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Old 12-26-2010, 08:14 AM   #76
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Yao is over a thousand years before Joshua, and the story doesn't really account for the time zone change. It also is not exactly strikingly similar to Joshua.

Maybe there's a better fit somewhere, but this is the best I can come up with... nutty fucking xians.
Good point.

Many cultures have legends about strange sky phenomena. Angels coming down, chariots of fire, arrow chains up to the sky, multiple suns, multiple moons, the sun setting in the east, rainbows announcing the end of floods, star guides to important goals, etc. That the bible should also list peculiar sky phenomena shouldn't be at all surprising. What would be strange would be the lack of any such happenings in that work.
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