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Old 06-10-2005, 07:46 AM   #11
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...the precise Hebrew wording...
This point can't be emphasized enough: we are talking about - and only about - the Hebrew texts. Translations need not apply as they are by definition imprecise recharacterizations.

One thing I have never understood about Christian evangelicals: if the text is as important to them as they say, why are they reading it in English?
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Old 06-10-2005, 08:23 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Wallener
One thing I have never understood about Christian evangelicals: if the text is as important to them as they say, why are they reading it in English?
Because that's how their blonde-haired, blue-eyed Jesus would have wanted it.
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Old 06-10-2005, 01:51 PM   #13
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David Halivni's Peshat & Derash: Plain and Applied Meaning in Rabbinic Exegesis is one book relevant to the discussion. In it he contends that each of the different periods of rabbinic Judaism - Tannaitic, Amoraic, etc. - were characterized by mostly (though not absolutely) discrete exegetical points of view. He argues, e.g., that the tannaim had a notably different opinion as regards the integrity of the scriptural text than subsequent generations, even the amoraim, and especially us moderns. They had no qualms about reading meaning into the text as truly authentic, even nullifying on occasion what to us would likely be the plain meaning (the halakhah, e.g., sometimes follows the applied meaning, although it actually contradicts the plain sense of the text). Two remarks of his that may be of special interest to the thread are the following:

(from p. 53):
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[The term] peshat, [used] in the sense of plain, simple meaning is entirely the invention of the medieval exegetes. It has no basis in the Talmud.
(from p. 79):
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The interpretive state of mind of medieval rabbis embodied a belief in the superiority of peshat over derash, which around the tenth century was projected back into the talmudic period.
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Old 06-14-2005, 02:58 PM   #14
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Thanks everyone for bringing this sort of information to light. It is greatly appreciated. You have all given me places to go to try to get better grasp on the question.

If I may throw out one more thing. Is it the opinion of many who have just answered here in this thread that the various interpretations of the text did affect the actual practices of Judaism throughout these ages? (I think there was one example above.)

Are there cases where we believe that Judaic practices varied apart from the rabbinic interpretations of the time?

DC
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Old 06-14-2005, 03:22 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by DigitalChicken
...[do] the various interpretations of the text did affect the actual practices of Judaism throughout these ages?
Absolutely. You don't have to look any further than a Jewish kitchen on Shabbat or at holiday time to see different interpretations manifesting themselves as different practice.
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Old 06-15-2005, 11:45 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Wallener
Absolutely. You don't have to look any further than a Jewish kitchen on Shabbat or at holiday time to see different interpretations manifesting themselves as different practice.
That is true today but have these changes and variances occurred throughout these various phases of Jewish theology?

DC
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:05 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by DigitalChicken
That is true today but have these changes and variances occurred throughout these various phases of Jewish theology?
Given the number of Israeli and Jewish kings who felt compelled to wander the countryside "restoring the ways of the Lord" - each in their own variant! - it would appear significant variance has always been there. We know it's here now, we know it was there late 2nd temple, and if it wasn't there as early as 6th century BCE there wouldn't have been a need for Josiah to "discover" the book of laws.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:08 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by DigitalChicken
That is true today but have these changes and variances occurred throughout these various phases of Jewish theology?

DC
Josephus described three major schools of thought among Jews in the first century which differed drastically from each other on major points, and it is generally assumed that he simplified things a great deal.
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