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Old 03-23-2009, 08:07 AM   #51
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Sometimes it seems like the early writings are actually waiting for a "first coming" and not, in my view a later understanding, a "second coming".
Agree. Paul sounds like he is awaiting the coming of Jesus, not the return of Jesus.
It's hard to say what Paul meant, since we have no idea what was actually written by Paul vs other writers, assuming Paul even existed.

But my preferred guess, is that "Paul" was not originally referring to Christ coming as a man in physical form at all, but was instead referring to the manifestation of Christ within believers . I think this may be a better way of understanding some of the more cryptic things Paul says, such as "I am crucified with Christ". If I'm right, then the portions of Paul's letters that suggest a historical Christ were later add-ons.
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Old 03-23-2009, 11:15 AM   #52
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Sometimes it seems like the early writings are actually waiting for a "first coming" and not, in my view a later understanding, a "second coming".
Agree. Paul sounds like he is awaiting the coming of Jesus, not the return of Jesus.
But, the writer Paul sounded on many occasions like he knew that Jesus was betrayed, crucified, died and was resurrected.

The writer Paul did not make any "first coming" sound.

1Th 4:16 -
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For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first..
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Old 03-23-2009, 09:09 PM   #53
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Latter writers stuffed a lot of crap into "Paul's" mouth. He was the church's all-time favorite sock-puppet talking head, who would always say whatever they made him say.
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Old 03-23-2009, 09:43 PM   #54
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Latter writers stuffed a lot of crap into "Paul's" mouth. He was the church's all-time favorite sock-puppet talking head, who would always say whatever they made him say.
But, "Paul's" mouth was the Church's mouth.

No variation in content of the letters with the name Paul have ever been found.

P46 contains essentially the fundamental information for the parts of the passages found in the letters as we have them today.

It is just miraculous, incredible that letters written 300 years earlier would be canonised without being edited.

But why edit when you can just re-write history?
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