Toto

moderator note:

Please note the opening post, and try to tie anything you write to that specific topic - non-Christian historical sources that might or might not concern Jesus.

Off topic posts have been split off here

Ben C Smith

There is no outrage. I do not recommend picketing, lobbying, or lynching.

It was a simple question. I am getting the impression that the answer is: No, to the best of our knowledge, these bold claims are not supported elsewhere on the site.

That may be.

Ben.

Roger Pearse

No, I think not. It's a wretched collection of stale old hearsay, uncritically believed and eagerly repeated. I read it, wondering if the compiler had ever had a critical thought in his life, or ever questioned his principle that whatever is convenient is true.

Always nice to see the bogus form of the 'quote' from Justus of Tiberias; since the full text is available online, the presence of this is a 'fingerprint' to indicate lack of research.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Johnny Skeptic

Message to Roger Pearse: Since you do not like the link that I posted, please start a new thread and discuss your non-Biblical sources regarding the alleged miracles of Jesus. Let's see how bold you actually are. What I prefer are first century sources. Please be sure to discuss where your sources got their information from.

Ben C Smith

Do you mean this quote?

'I have read the chronology of Justus of Tiberias ... and being under the Jewish prejudices, as indeed he was himself also a Jew by birth, he makes not one mention of Jesus, of what happened to him, or of the wonderful works that he did.'

I see Jesus is used here instead of the advent of Christ. Is that the fingerprint?

I have the Greek on my Justus of Tiberias page, along with my own translation and also that of Freese, with a link to your site (whence I got both his translation and his footnotes).

Ben.

Roger Pearse

The fingerprint I use is "not one mention". That's the hearsay version. I don't actually know the ultimate source, although I've seen it often enough.

That said, I read too hastily; another feature of the fingerprint is to *start* the quote with "he makes not one mention". This one gives some of the context, which is better than most, and which I don't usually see (although still not from the Freese version).

Glad you have the Greek, and that I was able to help.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Johnny Skeptic

Message to Roger Pearse: Since you do not like the link that I posted, please start a new thread and discuss your non-Biblical sources regarding the alleged miracles of Jesus. Let's see how bold you actually are. I prefer first century sources. Please be sure to discuss where your sources got their information from.

I predict that you will refuse to start a new thread because you know that you are not adequately prepared to defend your sources. If that is what will happen, you are obviously not the scholarly person that you pretend to be.

It would not be reasonable for you to criticize skeptic writings without offering what you believe are better alternatives.

Johnny Skeptic

Would you like to post some first century, non-Christian sources regarding the miracles that Jesus performed that you consider to be the most credible?

Ben C Smith

No. Why do you ask?

Ben.

aa5874

If Jesus of the NT did not exist, one would expect NO evidence or information from non-christian sources.

There is no information for Jesus of the NT, except for forgeries in Josephus.

The existence of Jesus is not more likely with NO evidence.

Jesus of the NT did not exist.

If it is true that Jesus of the NT existed, then one would expect SOME information from non-christian sources.

There is no information or evidence for Jesus of the NT from non-christian sources except for forgeries in Josephus.

Only evidence can make Jesus of the NT appear from nowhere.

The existence of Jesus of the NT is false, just like Achilles.