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Old 07-11-2008, 01:16 PM   #51
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There is no Christian tradition that the resurrection was unique, but there is a modern Christian apologetic argument that the resurrection was unique and therefore was not borrowed form some existing pagan religion, which shows that Christianity is unique ("Christian exceptionalism") and, being unique, is more likely to be the One True Religion.
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Old 07-11-2008, 01:35 PM   #52
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There is no Christian tradition that the resurrection was unique, but there is a modern Christian apologetic argument that the resurrection was unique and therefore was not borrowed form some existing pagan religion, which shows that Christianity is unique ("Christian exceptionalism") and, being unique, is more likely to be the One True Religion.
That is only in the context of the by-product of the very vast global information age where counter-arguments are constructed for the sole purpose of competing against agruments that are enchroachments into their very foundational beliefs, which is easy to attack. So any exceptionalism that a person holds, is in fact only partisan to whatever belief system he belongs to, or in other cases, a belief a person has by being a member of a organization that is always under constant competition from another organizations. You know, there are alot of organizations competing for more souls in order to survive?

So the word resurrection is constantly changing its meaning due to the ever changes of how it is used in whatever given context that the person (or organization) holds.
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Old 07-11-2008, 03:50 PM   #53
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I'm unaware of a Christian tradition that says resurrection stories were unique.
Try to ask some christian how many deities ressurected in 3 days were there in our history.

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I still fail to see how proof that Jews did believe the Messiah would rise from the dead in three days would have any bearing one way or the other as to the reality or myth of Jesus' resurrection.
Not exactly sure what would constitute proof in this case. As for significance, let me just quote expert, from original article:
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“This should shake our basic view of Christianity,” he said as he sat in his office of the Shalom Hartman Institute in Jerusalem where he is a senior fellow in addition to being the Yehezkel Kaufman Professor of Biblical Studies at Hebrew University. “Resurrection after three days becomes a motif developed before Jesus, which runs contrary to nearly all scholarship. What happens in the New Testament was adopted by Jesus and his followers based on an earlier messiah story.”
We see lot of three day motifs, even the ressurection-after-3-days motif, in same time in same area. It is very unlikely to be coincidence unrelated to Jesus story. But to claim the relation is prophetic is pretty hard too, because almost all details are different. That's why I think for intellectually honest people investigating christianity, this would be a big hit against it's more traditional explanations. Clear?
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Old 07-11-2008, 03:56 PM   #54
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But to claim the relation is prophetic is pretty hard too, because almost all details are different.

That didn't stop the author Mathew one bit....
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Old 07-11-2008, 04:12 PM   #55
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...in some sense this seems to auger a bit stronger for a historical Jesus who merely uses what is already around him in terms of messianic thought to create a movement.SLD
Creating a movement is no easy matter, even for the gods. But rising from the dead? Piece of cake.

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Old 07-12-2008, 07:55 AM   #56
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The after-three-days resurrection story which revolves around Jesus appears to originate in the OT book of Jonah.

Jonah 1:17
But the LORD provided a great fish to swallow Jonah, and Jonah was inside the fish three days and three nights. (NIV)

Then Jesus compared his prediction of his own resurrection, based on Jonah's story:

Matthew 12:40
For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. (NIV)

The description given of Jesus' death, burial and resurrection in the gospels makes the claim that Jesus was "in the heart of the earth" for "three days and three nights" a very apologetic stretch, since Jesus supposedly died on Friday afternoon and was resurrected before dawn on Sunday morning. By Jewish reckoning Friday, Saturday, and Sunday daytimes can be stretched into 3 days but there's no way for 3 nights to make it in there.

Was the story of Jonah common to Jewish belief about the prophesied messiah at the time of Jesus?

There were lots of resurrections recorded in the gospels, including Lazarus (after 4 days) and the "many saints" (dead for unknown times) who walked the streets after Jesus died (Matt 27:50-53).
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Old 07-12-2008, 08:49 AM   #57
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My two cents - NT resurrection story is a spinoff of Hosea 5:15, 6:1-2

"I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offense, and seek my face; in their affliction they will seek me early.

Come, and let us return unto the Lord; for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.

After two days will he revive us; in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight".

Mt. 11:5 presents this resurrection of the dead while Jesus is yet alive. What then is left is called a second death, not the second coming of Christ. The body of Christ (people) already resurrected, not to suffer a second death. (In Christ there is no sin).
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Old 07-12-2008, 12:24 PM   #58
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It would be interesting, not to say amusing, to research religions, mythologies and simliar superstitions all over the world to see if there are instances of things that happen in three days. I think there will be any number of those.
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Old 07-12-2008, 01:18 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by storytime View Post
My two cents - NT resurrection story is a spinoff of Hosea 5:15, 6:1-2

"I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offense, and seek my face; in their affliction they will seek me early.

Come, and let us return unto the Lord; for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.

After two days will he revive us; in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight".

Mt. 11:5 presents this resurrection of the dead while Jesus is yet alive. What then is left is called a second death, not the second coming of Christ. The body of Christ (people) already resurrected, not to suffer a second death. (In Christ there is no sin).
Good call, I hadn't noticed this exactly before, but this could explain why Jesus is actually revived in 2 days in Mark.
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Old 07-13-2008, 01:25 PM   #60
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It would be interesting, not to say amusing, to research religions, mythologies and simliar superstitions all over the world to see if there are instances of things that happen in three days. I think there will be any number of those.
It is called the "Rule of Three" — sometimes the "Law of Three." And it's a Western notion.
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