arkirk

I'm telling you that there is no good of any kind that comes from killing people. The proof is in the argument that the American Troops could
enter the apartment building at great danger to themselves to take out the sniper. If they won't vollunteer to deal one on one with Iraqi snipers, why should I or anybody else be doing it. The reason the sniper is there is that the Americans have come half way around the world to conquer that country and to dictate how it runs its own affairs. The sniper and his culture is under attack. He is as collateral as the innocent. Perhaps having never been exposed to the touted "Geneva Conventions." Your assumption is that whatever is done under an amerikan flag is greater good. I am not really expounding some sort of credo as you suspect.

What I have said over and over here is that we know there are a lot a lies associated with the invasion of Iraq. Part of what we feel we know may not be so. That is the nature of a lie-ridden society. If that is the case, then our so-called knowledge may in fact only be arbitrary lies selected for the pupose of getting us to go to war. Arbitrary information is not worth dying for...here or there or anywhere. It also is not worth killing for. If that's a credo so be it.

MattBeckwith

This discussion is interesting insofar as it treats ethical principles. I suggest we stay away from the specifics of the war in Iraq. In any case, there's a politics forum somewhere here.

It would be a terrible world if nobody could ever kill anybody else. Somebody breaks into your house and you can't shoot him? One country marches into another country to take it over and the defending army can't shoot them? Perhaps that's not what you really meant to say.

arkirk

Why spend all of our money and time defending things of very questionable value? In case you have not noticed the Iraq war is a war between religious ideologues. Wars generally are like that. I don't have all the information on all wars. This forum is an atheist forum and the Iraq war is an extension and application of western fundamentalist religious values by leaders who arbitrarily count me and you "in." Because atheists are generally too faint hearted or too frightened of the consequences of weighing in on large issues of the time...they are not even considered. Just ask your leader GWB if this is a christian nation and if the war is the work god has assigned him. You cannot dance around generalities and actually say anything of value.

I am saying that we need to avoid at almost all costs violence that results in the death of our human brothers. Obviously, in case you hadn't noticed, the muslims were at our very doors with nukes and 1948 model tanks and claymore mines. Let's get real here. There is no reason whatever for the U. S. to murder people in Iraq.

spidermantx

Could you please come up with a more probable scenario? It is an impossibility that one person could die and stop terrorism.

But, to answer your question, no, I would not die to stop terrorism. What good would it do?

Mace

No. I can't think of anything I'd die for in realistic terms. And while that seems selfish, so be it. No.

No.

JamesBannon

In this situation, no. On the other hand, there are situations where I would expect to be sacrificed. E.g., if I'm on a hijacked aeroplane heading for a big city where a crash would kill thousands I'd expect the aircraft to be shot down before it entered the danger zone. If I was the politician on the other end asked to take the decision in such an eventuality I would order the aircraft to be shot down.

arkirk

There really never is a point of volunteering is there in this matter? Could you "accept it?" I suppose you would have to accept it. Like it? I don't think so. Don't worry about being denied the choice in America. We let the hijacked planes reach their targets here. We keep it open for the hostages to become heroes to the last second...probably just because we are incompetent. In the event you're on the receiving end of the terrorism, do not expect the F-16 to come streaking to your defense and knock down that errant airliner. You will have a lot of tears shed for you and a lot of aliens will die overseas where we use mostly helicopters. (Possibly the reason for the terrorism in the first place is our attempt at world economic and military hegemony.):banghead:

JamesBannon

Arkirk,

Take it easy, I only mentioned this as a possible scenario. Of course I would not like it very much but what choice would there be in such an event? This is a scenario known to many as the "death game" and can be "played" in many different ways. E.g., we have 9 patients requiring a new kidney but only 6 kidneys, which 3 don't get the kidney? No matter which way you choose, 3 people are going to die. this kind of decision happens in hospital all the time. It is the same with the aeroplane. Which is better, 245 deaths of 1000? Like I said, in such an event I would reluctantly have to choose life for 1000.