Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Jeffrey Gibson · 04-03-2008, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charles Gadda

Well, what does Martin Abegg mean by "Evangelical Christian scholars"? Merriam Webster's Third New International Dictionary defines the term "evangelical" as "relating to, or being a religious group emphasizing salvation by faith in the atoning death of Jesus Christ through personal conversion, the authority of scripture, etc." This definition fits in with what is well known: that a basic evangelical tenet is that the Jews must convert to Christianity before the "end of days" can come. Does Martin Abegg disagree with this philosophy? If not, how does he square his perspective with the "significant role" he speaks of? I.e., what is the particular quality "Evangelical Christian scholars" possess, which makes them particularly suited for Dead Sea Scrolls research and for creating Dead Sea Scrolls museum exhibits?

Why don't you ask him yourself? He may be reached at:

abegg at twu.ca

I trust you have the courage of your convictions to do so?

Jeffrey Gibson

Charles Gadda · 04-03-2008, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Why don't you ask him yourself? He may be reached at [...]

I trust you have the courage of your convictions to do so?

Jeffrey Gibson

I would be happy to do so, were he and other scholars of his persuasion to begin acknowledging the value of open debate with scholars who oppose his and their ideas, including, e.g., in lecture series on subjects such as the Dead Sea Scrolls in museum exhibits and international conferences like ASOR/SBL.

In the meantime, I'd be happy to discuss the matter with him right here on this site, where everyone can see the give and take of the discussion instead of having it buried in a secret exchange of emails. Let Dr. Abegg engage in a free and open discussion, wouldn't that also take a modicum of intellectual courage?

Jeffrey Gibson · 04-03-2008, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charles Gadda

Quote:

Why don't you ask him yourself? He may be reached at [...]

I trust you have the courage of your convictions to do so?

Jeffrey Gibson

I would be happy to do so, were he and other scholars of his persuasion to begin acknowledging the value of open debate with scholars who oppose his and their ideas, including, e.g., in lecture series on subjects such as the Dead Sea Scrolls in museum exhibits and international conferences like ASOR/SBL.

You know for a fact that he isn't open?

Jeffrey

Charles Gadda · 04-03-2008, 03:13 PM

Quote:

You know for a fact that he isn't open?

No, I don't know it for an absolute "fact," but I don't see any evidence that he has ever raised his voice to encourage open debate on the Dead Sea Scrolls or to condemn the conduct of the museums and the rigging of lectures at ASOR/SBL. In fact, he was intimately involved as "consultant" in the biased Seattle exhibit; I can find no evidence that he lifted a finger to try and change their policy of exclusion and misrepresentation.

Charles Gadda · 04-07-2008, 12:37 PM

Jeffrey Gibson said:

Quote:

You know for a fact that he isn't open?

Well, Jeffrey, why hasn't Martin joined our little conversation? Is it beneath his dignity to participate in a forum where individuals are free to ask questions about his institute's platform, and about the exclusion of scholars who fundamentally disagree with his scholarly views from museum exhibits? Does he prefer to allow confusion to reign over the meaning of "evangelical" in that platform? Does this silence of his say anything about his attitude towards ordinary people like you and me? Does it suit his role as educator?

Champion · 04-07-2008, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Well, Jeffrey, why hasn't Martin joined our little conversation? Is it beneath his dignity to participate in a forum where individuals are free to ask questions about his institute's platform, and about the exclusion of scholars who fundamentally disagree with his scholarly views from museum exhibits?Does he prefer to allow confusion to reign over the meaning of "evangelical" in that platform? Does this silence of his say anything about his attitude towards ordinary people like you and me? Does it suit his role as educator?

How do you expect this guy to know about your "little conversation"? Do you think he Googles his own name everyday just in case someone ranted about him on an internet forum? If ordinary people like you and me wish to open a discussion with professional scholars (I use the term loosely) or total strangers then we should have the common sense to contact them. I can't imagine how many dates I might have missed if I hadn't told the girl we were having one.

Jeffrey Gibson · 04-07-2008, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charles Gadda

Jeffrey Gibson said:

Quote:

You know for a fact that he isn't open?

Well, Jeffrey, why hasn't Martin joined our little conversation?

Probably because you haven't the courage of your convictions to write to him and let him know it's going on, let alone to ask him the questions you so boldly addressed to him.

Quote:

Is it beneath his dignity to participate in a forum where individuals are free to ask questions about his institute's platform, and about the exclusion of scholars who fundamentally disagree with his scholarly views from museum exhibits? Does he prefer to allow confusion to reign over the meaning of "evangelical" in that platform? Does this silence of his say anything about his attitude towards ordinary people like you and me? Does it suit his role as educator?

Again, ask him.

Jeffrey

Charles Gadda · 04-07-2008, 01:44 PM

Quote:

How do you expect this guy to know about your "little conversation"? ... If ordinary people like you and me wish to open a discussion with professional scholars ... then we should have the common sense to contact them.

Quote:

Probably because you haven't the courage of your convictions to write to him and let him know it's going on, let alone to ask him the questions you so boldly addressed to him.

What makes the two of you so sure that Dr. Abegg hasn't been contacted and informed? Does he deny he has been contacted? Wouldn't that be a bit cowardly?

Jeffrey Gibson · 04-07-2008, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charles Gadda

Quote:

How do you expect this guy to know about your "little conversation"? ... If ordinary people like you and me wish to open a discussion with professional scholars ... then we should have the common sense to contact them.

Quote:

Probably because you haven't the courage of your convictions to write to him and let him know it's going on, let alone to ask him the questions you so boldly addressed to him.

What makes the two of you so sure that Dr. Abegg hasn't been contacted and informed? Does he deny he has been contacted? Wouldn't that be a bit cowardly?

So did you contact him or not?

Jeffrey

Jeffrey Gibson · 04-07-2008, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charles Gadda

Given our exchange a few days ago, why would you think I didn't contact him?

Given that I asked a yes or no question and you posted the above in reply to it, what reason do I have to think you did?

So, yes or no, did you e-mail Abegg using the address I gave you.

If you have, may we see what you sent? You did say you wanted any exchange with him to be public.

Jeffrey

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