spin

You still are ignorant of the issue. The definition doesn't involve the English term used as I've already pointed out; it's the collocations. Your continued sidetracking of the thread on this subject only shows your lack of seriousness.

As you don't understand the issue, you'll keep making the same mistake.


spin

Toto

Please avoid preaching in this forum. Please avoid personal accusations of dishonesty, or words to that effect.

ynquirer

Post Achaemenid Aramaic dialects are as a rule well attested. In Northern Arabia, Palmyra, and Parthia, there are a great number of stone-carved inscriptions with recognizable scripts, which can be more or less easily listed in as ‘witnesses’.

No such a thing has been found in Judea to attest second-century written Aramaic similar to Daniel's. There are several Aramaics as used by the Jews in the mid-2nd cent. or shortly afterward, such like Hasmonaean, Targumic and Qumranic, but they are not similar to Daniel's; they may not be called 'Imperial' in any reasonable meaning of the word.

Daniel remains an island in the linguistic sea of Judea during the Hellenistic period.

wavy_wonder1

but i wonder if david conklin's monograph on the date of daniel has been brought up. it addresses all the points in the op and i'm curious about what anyone has to say about it.



~eric

arnoldo

Minimalist reject all events in the bible as fictional stories which use real persons and settings :huh: Also the only evidence that an event in the bible happened is to find archaelogical proof. Until archaeological evidence is found that confirms the book of daniel then it must be written after the fact. The Dead Sea Scrolls are not accepted at this time of evidence of an early date for the book of daniel.

spin

Dealt with through this and various other threads. Calling the work of stitching together a collection of opinions favorable to one's position a monograph doesn't make it so. By favoring opinions the writer shows he doesn't know what he is supposed to be using to support his positions.

We frequently have inerrantist christians come here advocating these sorts of materials in an effort to justify the institutional errors they support.

What I ask people to do is to look at the scholarly commentaries about Daniel, such as the one by John J. Collins (et al) on the book of Daniel; there are older ones by Robert Anderson and D.S. Russell. But the important criterion is that it is a scholarly, not a devotional, commentary. See what recognized scholars in the field say. You can't just pluck a page of internet whose merits you cannot validate. Scholars have to publish their efforts before the eyes of other scholars who will destroy works that are not thoroughly sound and defensible.

And if you know something tangible about historical methodology, you can get your hands dirty with primary evidence.


spin

wavy_wonder1

many holy books and myths 'use real persons and settings'. i'm not sure of the relevance of this statement. are we making special pleas for your particular holy book?

i think the uncovering of a manuscript of daniel or confirmed quotations of daniel in other books prior to the maccabean era that actually reference the quotations as from a work of daniel would be irrefutable proof that the book of daniel is inspired and its prophecies genuine. but what does this have to do with the dss?


~eric

spin

The earliest copy of Daniel from the Dead Sea Scrolls is later 2nd c. BCE. Therefore the DSS are no help for your efforts to date Daniel, because later 2nd c. BCE is half a century after the dating that has been argued here.

I don't know what vainness has you babbling about minimalism here. Why don't you spend some money and go and buy a scholarly commentary -- you know, book -- and invest your time trying to understand it?


spin

wavy_wonder1

i'm no scholar. just an amateur, but the book of daniel (along with the resurrection and tyre 'prophecy') are a few study topics i've been investigating. i'm pretty square on other biblical issues in general (like inerrancy, etc.) but these three things specifically have captured my attention lately.


~eric

wavy_wonder1

but until then (broke for the present) i'm pretty much stuck to message boards and internet articles. but what would be your opinion on why the qumran sect would readily accept daniel so soon after its composition, or why they considered him a 'prophet'?


~eric