Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Kapyong · 08-21-2009, 02:26 PM

Gday,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

John said he was at the crucifixion with the women, Mary Magdalene and the mother of Jesus.

No he didn't.
Which is why you didn't quote any evidence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

The disciples witnessed what they believed to be Jesus alive from the dead.

Not one authentic NT writing claims to have met Jesus personally.
Only the forged 2 Peter has a claim to have met Jesus.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

People were allowed to worship their own gods just as Christians worshiped the God of the Bible, so they weren't killed for worshiping some god, but because they claimed Jesus was seen alive from the dead with their very own eyes.

There are NO authentic claims to have seen Jesus.
Which is why you failed to quote any such claim.

K.

Biblo · 08-21-2009, 02:27 PM

John wrote in John he was at the crucifixion. Peter wrote Peter, James wrote James, Matthew wrote Matthew, Paul wrote his epistles, Mark saw Jesus and notes it in Mark and Jude in Jude.

All of it was completed in the first century.

Toto · 08-21-2009, 02:27 PM

Biblio - I have to ask this. Are you getting course credit for posting this here? Which seminary?

Kapyong · 08-21-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

Cephas was one of the Pillars and there is no other original Apostles besides Peter who is called Cephas.

Wrong.
Some early Christian writings have Peter AND Cephas.
Which has been explained to you, but you just keep ignoring the facts.

Preaching your faith, while ignoring the facts - does nothing here.

K.

bacht · 08-21-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

A serious conversation should always come down to a person trying to find a naturalistic explanation to account for the resurrection data, and when they find they are not able to, they inevitibly give their lives to Christ or according to the Bible, shall be resurrected for Hell.

This is backwards. There's no such thing as resurrection, so the naturalistic explanation for such claims is that the witnesses are deluded or dishonest.

Biblo · 08-21-2009, 02:30 PM

Cephas is never thought of as other than Peter. There are not a second set of pillars. Cephas was one of the original 12.

Kapyong · 08-21-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

For example, Polycarp knew John and Clement of Rome knew Peter.

Polycarp never mentioned meeting John.
John never mentioned meeting Polycarp.

Clement never mentioned meeting Peter.
Peter never mentioned meeting Clement.

What you have is CLAIMS from LATER believers, not evidence.

K.

Biblo · 08-21-2009, 02:31 PM

You can't resurrect naturally, so it must be God.

Biblo · 08-21-2009, 02:31 PM

Yes Polycarp said he knew John. Clement of Rome Peter. It's all documented.

My favorite book is The Case for the Resurrection of Jesus by Gary R. Habermas.

Kapyong · 08-21-2009, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biblo

Nobody is more well documented in antiquity than was Jesus and so closely dated documents to the events.

Rubbish.

We have a vast body of evidence for many people, including statues, coins, first hand accounts, archeology.

We have NOTHING for Jesus.
No evidence at all.

Just stories and claims from believers long after the alleged events.

K.

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08-21-2009, 02:27 PM	#52
Biblo Banned Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Alberta Posts: 171	John wrote in John he was at the crucifixion. Peter wrote Peter, James wrote James, Matthew wrote Matthew, Paul wrote his epistles, Mark saw Jesus and notes it in Mark and Jude in Jude. All of it was completed in the first century.

08-21-2009, 02:27 PM	#53
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Biblio - I have to ask this. Are you getting course credit for posting this here? Which seminary?

08-21-2009, 02:30 PM	#56
Biblo Banned Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Alberta Posts: 171	Cephas is never thought of as other than Peter. There are not a second set of pillars. Cephas was one of the original 12.

08-21-2009, 02:31 PM	#58
Biblo Banned Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Alberta Posts: 171	You can't resurrect naturally, so it must be God.

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