Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Vajradhara · 11-09-2004, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

Bodhidharma went east, but there was a Buddhist monk from Afghanistan who carried Buddhism to Tibet (forgot his name) who was probably in a better geographical position to go west rather than east.

Padmasambhava, the Lotus Born, is the Tantric Guru that brought Vajrayana Buddhism to Tibet in the inital spreading in 700 C.E.

Yeshi · 11-10-2004, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yeshi

The old teachings are transferred to Tibet by Padmasambhava who is of Oddiyana (Bactria? origin)

noone sees my letters, was Castaneda right?

premjan · 11-10-2004, 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yeshi

noone sees my letters, was Castaneda right?

I skimmed over your longish post before getting to the end of it.

gurugeorge · 11-16-2004, 01:18 AM

Hmmm, another point: hasn't there been some speculation in academic circles that some aspects of the Dzogchen teachings might have come from the West? (I gather the correct location of Oddiyana, the posited origin of those teachings, hasn't quite been settled, but if it was as far to the West as Afghanistan, this connection might be plausible.)

Particularly, the emphasis on "light" seems to be something that could possibly have come from Manichaeism and/or Gnosticism.

Yeshi · 11-16-2004, 03:27 AM

Have to check books for that. In "Golden Letters" by Vajranatha there is extensive part on history of Garab Dorje (skt. Prahevajra?) who was the original transmitter of Dzogchen according to Nyingma tradition. Actually that's an excellent book to read if you did not yet.

I think he was the native of Oddiyana, too, and lived approximately around Buddha Sakyamuni times.

According to Bön, those teachings originated 18.000 years ago probably in central Asia as part of shamanic tradition...

Yeshi · 11-16-2004, 03:30 AM

Shambhala, whereever it might be

Quote:

Originally Posted by (on the web)

Origination

Whereas general Buddhism relates back to the teachings of Buddha Shakyamuni, (who lived approximately two and a half thousand years ago), Yungdrung Bön traces its lineage directly back to its founder, Bhuddha Tonpa Shenrab Miwoche, who came and taught in Wolmo Loong Ring (otherwise known as Shambhala) over 18,000 years ago. From there, his teachings spread around the world in different guises, being introduced into Tibet from the neighbouring country of Zhang-Zhung, which includes western Tibet and Mount Kailash.

lenrek · 12-22-2004, 04:12 AM

Maybe is late into the discussion, but found a link that seems to be related:

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/canon...iln/index.html

From the link:

Quote:

...What is most interesting about the Milindapañha is that it is the product of the encounter of two great civilizations - Hellenistic Greece and Buddhist India - and is thus of continuing relevance as the wisdom of the East meets the modern Western world. King Milinda poses questions about dilemmas raised by Buddhist philosophy that we might ask today. And Nagasena's responses are full of wisdom, wit, and helpful analogies...

premjan · 12-22-2004, 04:30 AM

Milinda is actually the Greek satrap Menander, isn't it? From which place was Nagasena?

lenrek · 12-22-2004, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

Milinda is actually the Greek satrap Menander, isn't it? From which place was Nagasena?

Yes, AFAIK, Milinda in the Milindapañha is actually Greek king Menander of Bactria (the dominion founded by Alexander the Great).

I am not very sure about Nagasena. Since this record the encounter of Hellenistic Greece and Buddhist India, I suspect he was from India.

By the way, from some other sources that I know, Nagasena was an enlightened being.

premjan · 12-22-2004, 07:28 AM

I am not sure where Nagasena was from originally, but apparently he used to teach in Patna (Patalipura).

12-22-2004, 04:30 AM	#28
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	Milinda Milinda is actually the Greek satrap Menander, isn't it? From which place was Nagasena?

12-22-2004, 07:28 AM	#30
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	Nagasena I am not sure where Nagasena was from originally, but apparently he used to teach in Patna (Patalipura).

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11-16-2004, 01:18 AM	#24
gurugeorge Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: London, UK Posts: 3,210	Hmmm, another point: hasn't there been some speculation in academic circles that some aspects of the Dzogchen teachings might have come from the West? (I gather the correct location of Oddiyana, the posited origin of those teachings, hasn't quite been settled, but if it was as far to the West as Afghanistan, this connection might be plausible.) Particularly, the emphasis on "light" seems to be something that could possibly have come from Manichaeism and/or Gnosticism.

11-16-2004, 03:27 AM	#25
Yeshi Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Munich Posts: 1,806	Have to check books for that. In "Golden Letters" by Vajranatha there is extensive part on history of Garab Dorje (skt. Prahevajra?) who was the original transmitter of Dzogchen according to Nyingma tradition. Actually that's an excellent book to read if you did not yet. I think he was the native of Oddiyana, too, and lived approximately around Buddha Sakyamuni times. According to Bön, those teachings originated 18.000 years ago probably in central Asia as part of shamanic tradition...

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