arnoldo

Absolutely, if Israel didn't posess nukes (which it uses as a deterrent) it would have been destroyed years ago. Read the OT, God frequently used the military of various nations to intervene on behalf of Israel.

cgordon

Heya HL,

Well, we can't look forward to Heaven (or Hell), mainly because they only ever exist right here and now. We create Heaven or Hell in our own heads, where we sit and live and sleep.

You have a grand opportunity. Make your life meaningful and relevant and interesting and honest and loving. It's what we do, we story-telling apes.

I'm going thru a bit of hell right now, as I prepare to move away from a place I love and start a new life and new adventures back in the USA. But I've got my head on, my game on and Hedgewitch and I are going to have fun doing it.

Hang in there, and remember that today, you are. And being is a wonderful thing to experience.

(It sure beats the alternatives, anyhow ...)

Doug Shaver

I didn't hear it my whole life. I was brought in an unreligious home, but got converted into an evangelical sect when I was 12.

I left the sect when I was 18. I'm 62 now, but I still remember that transition as one of the most traumatic experiences of my life. I'm mighty glad it happened, of course, but at the time, I was scared sh*tless.

WVIncagold

lets dissect shall we.
first we must look at the posters OP here. sugarhitman contends that Jesus is god Yahweh and is the earthly embodiment of that god. So in that sense you must accept all things OT as Jeus's fault. He is god in an earthly form. So he carries all that baggage. so lets examine and compare Deity's shall we.

Deity 1
1. Expects absolute worship
2. Only get to good after life through him
3. makes you ashamed of yourself (sin)
4.Has dictated wars in his name
5. has you rejoice in bashing enemy
children's head in
6. sends most humans to a fiery hell
including infants who have not accepted him
7. gives free will but punishes you if you
use it
8. expects you to change how you act
work live etc.
9. created at least 4 genocides
10. claims all powerful but unable to
vanquish evil (lies)
11. likes human sacrifice
12. enjoys ritualistic cannibalism and
vampire behavior of followers
13. condones slavery and rape
14. makes confusing prophecy
15. gives ancient book to men that is
supposed to be divine and inerrant but is not
16. constantly tries to lure you from other lines of thought

deity 2
1 doesn't want your worship never asks for it
2 makes no such claim
3 cares less if you sin
4 no wars ever fought in his name
5 never lays claim to killing children
6 Never sends humans to hell
7 encourages free will
8 accepts you as you are
9 no genocides to his name
10 Makes no such claim
11 makes no request
12 bread is bread wine is just wine
13 makes no such claims
14 no prophecies
15 no ancient books no claim.
16 inserts ideas into your head to make you think differently than dogmatic fundamentalism


These are just a few off my head. Deity one shows definite signs of evil, Deity two does not. Deity number one sure looks evil any venture to guess who Deity two may be?:devil1:

Moriah Conquering Wind

^^ QFT ^^

However in all fairness, not all Christians understand Jesus THAT way. Mainly the bigoted self-serving fundie idiot type. Some actually bother to study the matter out with regard to other passages in scripture, what bigger picture there can be found and what the words in the original languages mean. The fundy bigot types get all anti-intellectual, literalistic, and won't bother learning anything other than the regurgitated crap spewed to them from even bigger fatter idiots administering spiritual abuse from the pulpits of fundy bigot strongholds.

sugarhitman

So when does God send infants to hell? When does he "rejoices" when babies's heads are bashed in? You are so woefully ignorant and unruly that you cant even distinguish between sadistic terrorism and righteous Judgement.......call it what you want but the Lord "will punish the world for its' evil" Anarchists see the one as evil who holds the power of Authority who has the sword at his side. (common criminals also dispise law enforcement and authority) But wise people understand that such a thing is needed to guard against people of like minds.

Moriah Conquering Wind

Proper "punishment for evil" does not involve becoming evil itself in the process.
Not to mention, proper "punishment" in any context serves a rehabilitative purpose. When your children mouth off or disobey, you don't punish them by taking them out into the street and throwing them under a lorrie to destroy them. You give them a time out or some other penalty as a means of using negative reinforcement to try to train them not to repeat the undesired behavior. Throwing sentient creatures into an eternally burning pit where they have no opportunity to learn anything and spend eternity in excruciating agony unable even to die (or if you prefer the annihilationist interpretation, eventually ending in their being snuffed from existence for all eternity) teaches absolutely nothing and serves no rehabilitative or salvific purpose whatsoever. Which bes why most people who can stick out the apparent contradictions of faith for longer than 2-5 years start digging past the regurgitated tripe served from the typical pulpit and start trying to investigate the original languages and the writings of scholars daring to bring some intelligence to bear upon divining the meaning of scripture, to determine what reality might lie past the lurking, drooling, offputting threshhold of concrete literalism and its horrors.

If you study your holy book carefully you will notice a paradox: the same God referred to as perfect and unchanging also frequently changes His mind. If you study further you will notice a pattern: His unchangingness bes only invoked in reference to His mercy.

People that clamor for "judgment" and harrumph bellicosely about imagining that they find themselves smack dab in the very risen cream of the milk of God's will bes in for one serious rude awakening. Only the spiritually blind clamor for judgment and argue it as righteous. Those what see clearly know they deserve it just as much as anyone else upon whose head they relish seeing it fall, and keep their polluted mouths shut as a result and their attitudes about themselves shoved down into humility range where they belong.

And the verse it believes the earlier poster to be referring to can be found in Psalm 137:9.

Moriah Conquering Wind

Also, likening anarchists to criminals bes a putrid relic and conceit of jackboot authoritarianism more properly ascribed to petty human tyrants and dictators than to an all-wise, all-merciful Creator.
Fact #1: the only right thing to do when faced with the seizure of political and governmental power by the corrupt which cannot be dislodged by non-violent means would be to organize a revolt (and an armed one if necessary);
Fact #2: what the tyrant wrongly calls rebellion, the people rightly call revolution;
Fact #3: you wouldn't be here enjoying the freedom to spew this twisted crap if it bes not for all those throughout history what gave their lives to fulfill those first two facts, so cram a sock in it already.

Now point that cancerous dominionist filth somewhere else. You think freethinkers what have already chosen atheism bes going to listen to that crap? BWAHAHAHAHA!!! They see clearly the inherent self-contradicting nature of the fundy's twisted line on "religion". Only difference being the atheist concludes that BES the faith of Christ and turns his back in scorn, whilst the person of faith gets stuck trying to clean up the mess your lot keep making for us and wrestling the despicable ugly whispering lies your lot sells us trying to infect us as well. But we will NOT be infected, because greater bes He what bes in US than He what bes in your Beastly world.

And herein lies this one's shortcoming. Jesus may not be ashamed to call you brethren, but this one sure as hell would be. Of course since the feeling bes likely to be mutual, it won't lose any sleep over it this week. But since you imagine your own salvation secure, it would rather put its neck on the block for the atheists than for the fundagelical dominionist perverters of the faith. At least atheists strive for intellectual honesty which bes way more noble than it sees most pulpit pounders doing.

arnoldo

You can get more disinformation by simply going to the skeptics annotated bible

Source: Psalm 137:9

arnoldo

Uhhh... the American revolution was pretty much a revolt against the corrupt British Empire...
Uhhh.. right, that's why Christianity is the greatest revolution because it is internal rather than external.
Right, now that you agree in free speech what do you think about freedom of religion?