Roger Pearse

Into which of those 3 groups do you see yourself fitting, Douglas?

I was unclear why you responded so violently and personally to what aChristian said. I didn't learn from your post on what basis you objected, tho, except that you didn't like it. The view given of the trinity is certainly standard among the fathers.

I don't think that anyone has mentioned Tertullian Adversus Praxean yet, so I will. I have Ernest Evans' excellent translation of it online at the Tertullian Project. This is the work in which 'trinitas' was first applied to a definite formula. Tertullian says that he is articulating the apostolic faith against a novelty.

I hope that helps.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Toto

The OP asked whether there was a Biblical basis for the trinity.

Tertullian's Adversus Praxean appears to try to do this, but it looks like it takes a lot of effort, for such a vital doctrine that people might burn in Hell (or the stake) for believing the wrong version.

douglas

Learner

I felt aChristian's characterization of the previous posts as "wacky" was unfair. Personally, I find people who think they have all the answers and sole possessors of the "truth," to be tiresome. My apologies if it came across as "violent," aChristian. I did not mean it in that way.

Which view are you referring to, and who's fathers are you talking about?

Roger Pearse

That would appear to be a claim that nothing complicated can be true. We neither of us believe this, I think.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Roger Pearse

I'm sorry that I wasn't clear. The view I had in mind was the one that the Trinity is witnessed to throughout the bible. Indeed I've been working on an Arabic text (John ibn Saba, The precious pearl: on ecclesiastical knowledge) that runs through church history from the creation on in something like 120 chapters, and it starts with the Trinity and explains the OT in just this way.

By the 'fathers' I mean the Fathers of the Church. The reason that I referenced these is to show that the view being expressed is a standard one, rather than a 'way out' view.

Whether we agree with any of these people, of course is another matter entirely, and I don't expect anyone in this forum to do so.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Salam

I see.. now it makes sense.

:banghead:

Chili

You mean he didn't have a dual identity? Show me where Jesus is addressed as Christ in any of the four gospels before his resurrection.

Oh right, and when Thomas exclaimed "my Lord and my God" the trinity was gone.

spin

One would expect a mainstream christian (whose creedal confession defines trinitarian beliefs) to say anything else. Look at the efforts of biblical examples and oh how often do they shrivel up under inspection.

But should a 14th c. work be of relevance here?


spin

Amaleq13

"witnessed to throughout throughout the Bible" clearly means "using faith to force the concept into various passages througout the Bible".