bajan

[QUOTE=GakuseiDon;3855190]The star DIDN'T lead them to Jesus. They saw the star, which indicated to them that a King of the Jews was born. So they went to Jerusalem. The star didn't lead them at all, so it didn't matter whether it rose in the east or the west.

When you say Jerusalem you mean Bethlehem. The question is what/who lead them to Bethlehem?

The explanation of how a star that appeared in the East could lead the Wise Men (who came from the East) to Bethlehem was once given to me as a star that started in the East and then moved over to the West. If this is so then, if anything, it was a planet or comet but certainly not a star.

Johnny Skeptic

To fundamentalist Christians I ask "Was God involved in the entire affair, and if so, how?"

Chili

Te Journey of the Magi is made in response to an inward journey by the believer that takes him back to the state of mind he was at birth and there gives an account of himself so that the inner man can be reborn in him. This would be why the Magi came from the East and Joseph from the West to meet in the middle under Herod instead of Pilate who is not even aware of this journey to say that the "I" of believer is not part of the journey.

The net effect here is that the 'I' in popular "I surrender all" itself is also surrendered which makes the birth of Christ a non-rational event in the mind of the believer that is incipient by God instead of the believer (Jn.1:13).

In Catholicism the Journey of the Magi is made when the believer recognizes the white candle in the Advent Wreath to be his very own Baptism Candle and therein finds a glimmer of hope for better days to come.

The slaughter of the Innocent is a necessary condition to bring peace on earth in admiration of the newborn King. It just proves that Mary is queen.

GakuseiDon

No, I mean Jerusalem.

Herod lead them to Bethlehem.

I don't think any of those could have stood over a certain spot.

Chili

[QUOTE=bajan;3855588]
Beth-le-hem means house of bread (or something like that) to say that Joseph was beyond theology or beyond surrender when Christ was born unto him. The "census" was "the account" or "the confession" which was non-rational because the stable was empty of reason (beyond theology) wherefore the shepherds were out on the night that Christ was born unto Joseph.

The journey to Bethlehem was a non-rational event and therefore an inward journey wherein Mary, who is the Woman that once was taken from Man, is in charge of the mind and hence the volition of the Joseph the upright Jew who in all sincerity wanted to know the meaning of life.

In Catholicism we have a mule and a donkey in the nativity to prove that Joseph was still beyond theology when the Magi arrived. The donkey and the mule represent the pacified Adam and Eve in the conscious mind wherefore Joseph was absent from the stable when the Magi looked in and saw only Mary and the child. IOW had Joseph been there they would not have entered and Easter would not have come without Epiphany.

Chili

Because the laws of nature took precedent over religion.

douglas

Magi??? Would the intended readers of Matthew have translated this word to mean the equivalent of Wise Men? The Wikipedia reference below leads me to believe that Magi was an actual tribe of people...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magi

Roger Pearse

The RAC?

All the best,

Roger Pearse

douglas

Sorry, forget my previous question. I missed this post.

John Kesler

One interesting aspect of this story occurs in Matthew 2:19-22:

Why would the "angel of the Lord" tell Joseph to move the family to the "land of Israel" when the angel knew, or should have known, that Archelaus was ruling over Judea? Why not just tell Joseph to move to Galilee in the first place?