Dave31

In over 20 passages throughout the canonical gospels claiming Jesus was famed far and wide not a single one has ever been substantiated with credible evidence.

outhouse

exactly

while alive he was a nobody less the temple incident and death.



he was said to have preached in front of large crowds but this was written by the unknown authors to compete with the roman "son of god's" who were also mortal men.


we also know the sermon on the mount is later fiction as he would not nor could not ramble off that many parables and hold peoples attention. the numbers are also logistically imposssible.

he would have said witty one liners that sunk in and took time for proper delivery, he also would have preached in small villages to small crowds at best, where he had to yell to get people to pay attention and actually listen to him.

aa5874

Sources please???? We no longer accept presumptions.

The sources which mention the Temple incident ALSO claimed Jesus was WELL-KNOWN.

If Jesus was NOT well known then we cannot accept that there was a Temple incident. The authors were probably writing Fiction.

How convenient!!!! You forget so soon that it was the UNKNOWN authors who wrote about the Temple incident.


The same author who wrote the Sermon on the Mount with numbers that "are also logistically imposssible" wrote of the the large crowds and the Temple incident.

Your sources for the Temple incident are NOT credible.

If what you say is true then the Temple incident is fiction. You have IDENTIFIED that the UNKNOWN authors stories don't make much sense. Jesus would have been in some unknown little village and NOT at the Temple over turning tables.

Jesus would have gotten his butt kicked and beaten to a pulp at the very Temple if he was real.

anethema

aa your wrong here. "knowing whether hed get his ass kicked" is presumptive. The rest of your argument is solid.

la70119

That's because Paul knows zip on whether Jesus was married or not. In fact, he hardly knows anything about the life of Jesus. What Paul knows about him can be boiled down to this:

Mind you, this is NOT recorded in proper order in one place in any one of his Epistles, but is scattered hither and yon across nearly all his writings in no particular order.

One would think he was making it up as he went along. At least that's how I see it. :huh:

outhouse

LOL thats the only solid point he made.


the tables had guards who normaly would dispatch someone instantly. Its the same as walking up to a bank teller.

theres 2 options at this point.

he escaped into the huge crowd into attendance

they let him escape to avoid starting a riot.


either way it was a death sentance.

aa5874

No, you are wrong. It is a LOGICAL deduction by Empiricism

outhhouse, you go to Jerusalem and overturn the tables of those who are transacting business and you will get your ass kicked solidly or clubbed by the police or both.

Jesus would NOT have been Scarcely known if he overturned the tables of those transacting business at the Temple. People would remember the IDIOT.

Logical

Look, I need to come clean here

On some level, we should both agree that we don't know crap. I love how "aa" keeps demanding a high standard of evidence, as if he's applying it to himself. (He's not). All we have is some BS written by superstitious idiots, starting with Paul and ending with the gospel writers, most of which is based on folklore. Would I bet my life on it? No. I wouldn't even bet a hundred bucks on any of it.

I really appreciate that some people (like Doherty) took the time to analyze this mess. I find it extremely interesting and important work. And I find ALL the theories interesting and worthy of consideration.

But let's not get all crazy and think that Doherty or Ehrman (or anyone) uncovered the truth about Jesus. We're all just making educated guesses.

The whole point of my OP was to point out that Doherty's "silences" are not the bomb shell he claims them to be. They're all very easily explainable. I do think, however, that traditionalists (catholics, evangelists, etc) should all be VERY worried about those "silences". They cannot be explained in their worldview. Also, the absence of contemporary historical records worthy of the great events attributed to Jesus should make them worried. Those also cannot be explained in their traditionalist model. So I'm thankful to Doherty for documenting all that.

Toto

In order to explain them, you need to hypothesize an earlier state of the movement that left no records and disappeared, and a historical Jesus who did and said nothing memorable but still was the "big bang" that led to the church.

This is not "easy". It is more like an epicycle piled on an ad hoc explanation.

aa5874

Did you NOT say you need to come clean?? Well, come clean.

I use the WRITTEN statements, the EVIDENCE from antiquity so you are NOT coming clean.

Why can't you come clean and ACT responsibly??

I don't use Myth Fables in the NT for History. I use the Myth Fables to EXPOSE Fiction, forgeries and Implausibilities.

When I show that gMatthew states Jesus was the Son of a Ghost and that Jesus walked on water in gMark it is NOT because it is true but it is the DESCRIPTION of Jesus.

In the Bible, Pilate was Governor, Tiberius was Emperor, Gabriel was an Angel, Satan was the Devil, and the Holy Ghost was the FATHER of Jesus, the Creator of heaven and earth.

I do NOT Make stuff up. I have a HIGH STANDARD---Evidence OR say nothing--No guessing on BC&H.

Why can't you TAKE responsibility for your OWN GUESSWORK and Speculation and stop blaming other people.

Come Clean. ALL you do is GUESS, GUESS, GUESS and now that you are confused you think other people are guessing.

Well, YOU guessed wrong again.

I am NOT Guessing.

People who claim Jesus was a man are GUESSING.

People who claim the Pauline writings were composed BEFORE C 70 ce are GUESSING.

We have enough evidence to stop the Guessing.

Look at Galatians 1.1 and STOP Guessing.

The Galatians writer claimed he was NOT the Apostle of a man.

Look at Galatains 1.10-12 and Stop Guessing.

The Galatians writer claimed he did NOT get his gospel from a human being.

Look at Galatians 2.20 & 4.4. and Stop Guessing.

The Galatians writer claimed Jesus was the Son of God.

Even if YOU don't know when Galatians was composed it is clear that the Galatians Jesus WAS Not a human being.

I don't Guess and I no longer accept Guessing as evidence.