Freethought & Rationalism Archive

squiz · 07-05-2007, 08:22 AM

Is patriotism a virtue or is it inherently evil, or is it some sort of necessary evil?

Sometimes I struggle with this issue and am interested in what people think.

ModernHeretic · 07-05-2007, 08:30 AM

Define patriotism.

If, as I think, nationalism = patriotism when talking about your own country, then I'm not so sure it's a good thing.

enoch007 · 07-05-2007, 08:47 AM

Patriotism is a feeling one has for one's country. As such, it should not be something encouraged or demanded from the leaders of that country. It is as inappropriate to demand love from another person as it is to demand their patriotism. Either one has it or not.

dancer_rnb · 07-05-2007, 08:52 AM

Unthinking patriotism is an evil.

.........when in the wrong, to be put right.

cobardon · 07-05-2007, 08:57 AM

Dulce et decorum est pro patria mori.

That's all you need to know about the horrors of patriotism.

squiz · 07-05-2007, 08:59 AM

Here are a couple of quotations to get you going:
Patriotism is a kind of religion; it is the egg from which wars are hatched. ~ Guy De Maupassant
Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel. ~ Samuel Johnson

DougP · 07-05-2007, 09:46 AM

I dont think its a good thing at all. People are people. Countries are completely arbitraty borders, and have nothing particularly to do with anything. I dont necessarily have a problem with having pride in the good things that a country might do, but its thing, not the country, you shoudl ahve pride in.

Neo-Nietzschean · 07-05-2007, 09:53 AM

Patriotism is evil. Pure and simple.

wallflower1996 · 07-05-2007, 10:08 AM

If patriotism means love for one's country, despites its flaws which you recognize and are willing to admit, then it's ok. But that's never EVER what Americans mean by the word. They use it to signify a mindless jingoism, and that is a great and contemptible vice.

KidFury · 07-05-2007, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DougP

I dont think its a good thing at all. People are people. Countries are completely arbitraty borders, and have nothing particularly to do with anything. I dont necessarily have a problem with having pride in the good things that a country might do, but its thing, not the country, you shoudl ahve pride in.

Exactly! You cannot be proud of what you are only of what you do.

07-05-2007, 08:22 AM	#1
squiz Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Munich Germany Posts: 434	Patriotism virtue or evil? Is patriotism a virtue or is it inherently evil, or is it some sort of necessary evil? Sometimes I struggle with this issue and am interested in what people think.

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07-05-2007, 08:30 AM	#2
ModernHeretic Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Maryland, USA Posts: 357	Define patriotism. If, as I think, nationalism = patriotism when talking about your own country, then I'm not so sure it's a good thing.

07-05-2007, 08:47 AM	#3
enoch007 Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 4,047	Patriotism is a feeling one has for one's country. As such, it should not be something encouraged or demanded from the leaders of that country. It is as inappropriate to demand love from another person as it is to demand their patriotism. Either one has it or not.

07-05-2007, 08:52 AM	#4
dancer_rnb Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Austin, Tx Posts: 2,520	Unthinking patriotism is an evil. .........when in the wrong, to be put right.

07-05-2007, 08:57 AM	#5
cobardon Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Scotland Posts: 951	Dulce et decorum est pro patria mori. That's all you need to know about the horrors of patriotism.

07-05-2007, 08:59 AM	#6
squiz Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Munich Germany Posts: 434	Here are a couple of quotations to get you going: Patriotism is a kind of religion; it is the egg from which wars are hatched. ~ Guy De Maupassant Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel. ~ Samuel Johnson

07-05-2007, 09:46 AM	#7
DougP Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 4,441	I dont think its a good thing at all. People are people. Countries are completely arbitraty borders, and have nothing particularly to do with anything. I dont necessarily have a problem with having pride in the good things that a country might do, but its thing, not the country, you shoudl ahve pride in.

07-05-2007, 09:53 AM	#8
Neo-Nietzschean Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: somewhere left of the Postmodern turn Posts: 684	Patriotism is evil. Pure and simple.

07-05-2007, 10:08 AM	#9
wallflower1996 Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Charlevoix, Michigan Posts: 1,055	If patriotism means love for one's country, despites its flaws which you recognize and are willing to admit, then it's ok. But that's never EVER what Americans mean by the word. They use it to signify a mindless jingoism, and that is a great and contemptible vice.

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