S.C.Carlson

There's no such thing because the term "Old Latin" refers to the various pre-Vulgate translations into Latin. The author of that web page is very confused, and those dates are all wrong.

Julian

The Old Latin Vulgate is also know as the Vetus Latina. It is biblical translations from the original languages into Latin done before the time of Jerome. It is not a single volume or anything like that but a large number of conflicting manuscripts.
I am not sure where you got that link from but stop reading it immediately. It is an obvious apologists site.
Well, we have fragments of christian writings going back to the second century (probably), most of that would be very incomplete. Also, bear in mind that a 'complete' bible from that era would not be the same as a standard bible today. The most important 'complete' bibles are from around 400 or so.

Julian

Koyaanisqatsi

Excellent thread all. A tad off-topic, but I always wondered why Greek? Do we know why Paul focused so much on Greece? Did he proselytize anywhere near Jerusalem? Do we have any extra-biblical evidence that the early Jesus cult even existed in or around Jerusalem and if so, what is it?

Also, who were the gospels written for? As I understand it, no "lay" person was allowed to read and/or didn't know how to read, so were the gospels supposed to be merely historical or some sort of cult textbook as they are used largely today?

Also, Paul's letters clearly indicated (IMO) that a form of synagogue/church hierarchy was already in place (and seems to presage the familiar Catholic hierarchy more so than it resembles Jewish hierarchy) in far away lands, which would imply either that Jesus had formed his cult long before his death or that his death happened much earlier. Any evidence that anyone knows to either confirm or contradict that?

Many thanks.

triffidfood

Okay, thanks guys, that explains it.

So, basically we’re dealing with a Christian apologetic deceit here then, I guess. I also found another site which repeats the same kind of assertions (or tries to give the same kind of misleading impression) here: http://www.scionofzion.com/olv.htm, which says:

Doug Shaver

For economic reasons more than any other, few people in those days could read, but there was never a prohibition on reading. Literacy was actually common among slaves, because people rich enough to own slaves would use them for secretaries.

Why Greek? Because Greek in those days was the language of intellectuals, similar to what Latin became during the Middle Ages and well into Renaissance times. If you were a Roman intellectual you might write in your native language of Latin, but for nearly everyone else, if you learned to read and write, then you learned to write Greek and you assumed that anyone you corresponded with could read Greek.

Koyaanisqatsi

Including Jews? Why wasn't everything written in Hebrew or Aramaic (i.e., the language of Jesus)?

Diogenes the Cynic

Because most of the audience didn't know Hebrew or Aramaic.

Hebrew was no longer a commonly spoken language even in Palestine. The spoken language of Palestinian Jews was Aramaic. Hebrew was pretty much a language only of liturgy and scripture (perhaps somehat akin to what Church Latin used to be like in Europe. The priests, scholars and scribes knew it but most of the rabble did not).

Greek was the lingua franca outside Palestine and was the language of Hellenistic Jews. They also used the Greek LXX rather than Hebrew texts of the Tanakh. Not only that but the audience for the Gospels and other writings of the NT was largely Gentile (and so were most of the authors, for that matter).

Julian

There is a difference between Greek and Greece. Greek was the common language throughout the middle east because of the conquest of Alexander the Great. Since the soldiers of Alexander spoke many different varieties of Greek a universal, or common, Greek emerged that eventually became the standard language that most people could speak. That form of Greek is called Koine, meaning common, as was the only language to use if you wanted to be sure that everyone would understand you. In The Passion of the Christ we see Pilate speaking Latin, which would never happen. If he had, no one would have been able to understand him. He would have been speaking Greek.

Paul didn't focus on Greece in particular, at least not what we today would define as the modern Greece. His letters span churches from Asia Minor all the way to Rome.
We do have some evidence even though it is sparse and late. It was probably mostly Jewish Christians, a type of christian that didn't survive the first few centuries of christianity.
We are not sure who they were written for although many theories abound on this topic. Most people were illiterate so they would have to be read aloud, in most cases. Michael Turton (Vorkosigan) has even suggested that the Gospel of Mark might have been performed, an intriguing suggestion.
There are theories that Jesus lived much earlier than is commonly assumed. However, any theory about christianity before Paul is pure speculation based on extremely scant evidence. There is much speculation in this field, speculation that probably goes far beyond what the evidence can bear. The Q document and the community that produced it is one such popular branch of speculation.

Julian

Julian

In addition to what Diogenes states above it is also worth noting that Jesus and his disciples did not write the NT. It was written by either Greek native speakers or authors who grew up in areas that were hellenized.

Julian

Diogenes the Cynic

I just want to expand on this slightly. Paul speaks of a group of "Pillars' living in Jerusalem and mentions Cephas (Peter in Greek), James and John by name. He indicates tension with this group but does not go into detail about who they were or what they believed. So as far as primary evidence goes, we actually do have something to indicate that some sort of cult or movement associated with Jesus existed by the mid 1st century in Jerusalem but we know virtually nothing about them, what they believed or how they viewed Jesus.