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Old 07-13-2005, 11:39 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by benja burns
It's often said that if a modern Christian were to examine the beliefs of the early Christians (as in, those who lived close to the time of Christ) they would be shocked to find that the early beliefs were very different from the current ones. Is this true? If so, what did the early Christians believe that would make the modern Christian say 'That can't be right'? Did they believe anything so completely different from modern beliefs that if a modern Christian believed it other Christians would deny that they were true believers?

If I recalled correctly, earliest followers of Christ never called themselves as Christians since they were Jews led by James and still retained their former beliefs and customs.

The labelling of "Christians" probably came after Paul began to convert gentiles. And if you want to know about the great difference between early Christianity and its modern form in the fastest way, just get a gnostic text/gospel and read it. Sad to say, its one of the few surviving forms of very early Christianity unorthodox sects known today.

Anyway, the several spilts or controvesy in Christianity occurred in the first few centuries, You might want to read more about it. Forgive me if I spell the names wrongly, but the sects that spilt from the Roman church at that time were a number ranging from lasting and influential ones like Arian, Nestorian, etc to short-lived and less supported ones like Monophyites, docetism, Monarchianism, etc.

So many that would make almost anyone confused and wonder why God would make such a mess out of His Words.
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Old 07-13-2005, 11:51 AM   #12
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Answerer:
The labelling of "Christians" probably came after Paul began to convert gentiles.
See here for the answer.
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Old 07-13-2005, 12:04 PM   #13
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I don't think they believed that Jesus was God.
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Old 07-13-2005, 02:59 PM   #14
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When was Acts written? When is the term christian used by others? When is this alleged useage in Antioch? What about chrestus?
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Old 07-14-2005, 11:49 AM   #15
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I was wondering the same question as well. When was Acts written? And given the nature of bible accounts, can it be fully trusted?
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Old 07-14-2005, 11:58 AM   #16
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The best guess is that Acts was written around 110 CE, possibly as late as 150 CE, but may incorporate some earlier material. Christians like to tout the historical accuracy of Acts, but they do this by comparing Acts to the histories written by Josephus, and there is a good argument that the author of Acts used Josephus as a source.

It would be naive to "trust" Acts as a source.
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Old 07-14-2005, 12:02 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Answerer
I was wondering the same question as well. When was Acts written? And given the nature of bible accounts, can it be fully trusted?
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/ says Acts is dated 80-130 CE. Acts is thought to be written by the same person as Luke.
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Old 07-14-2005, 12:08 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clivedurdle
When was Acts written? When is the term christian used by others? When is this alleged useage in Antioch? What about chrestus?
Acts is typically dated around 90-100 CE (some would date it later some much earlier) the reference to Christians at Antioch in Acts 11:26 is at face value 40 CE plus or minus a year or so. There is another reference to Christians in Acts 26:28 at Paul's trial before Agrippa set in 59 CE.

Christians are mentioned in the 1st Epistle of Peter, the letters of Ignatius, the TF in Josephus, the correspondence between Pliny and Trajan, the account by Tacitus of the Fire of Rome.

There are various problems with the date and authenticity of some of the above works but they mostly date in the very late 1st century early 2nd century. (IF 1 Peter is by the apostle Peter, which most scholars doubt, it would date from around 65 CE.)

Christians as early as 40 CE in Antioch does seem surprisingly early compared with the other data.

There is another point that the form of the Greek word ChRISTIANOS (Christian) implies Latin influence, making an origin in Rome rather than Antioch plausible.

It is IMHO likely that by the very late 1st century CE, when Acts was written, the term Christian was very widespread and the precise history of how it originated and spread had become confused.

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Old 07-14-2005, 12:54 PM   #19
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So would I be correct in assuming Pliny might actually be the first reference?
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Old 07-14-2005, 01:52 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clivedurdle
So would I be correct in assuming Pliny might actually be the first reference?
Yes IF you

a/ date 1 Peter in the 2nd century
b/ regard the TF as nonauthentic
c/ date Acts after 110 CE

Each of these is quite possible but it is IMO unlikely that all three are true.

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