hezekiah jones

But although you stipulated the tale is allegory, you appear to imply that the allegory bears at least enough relationship to the facts that the allegory is itself truth (and therefore not allegory).

Hence my confusion (which has by no means been allayed by your apparently rhetorical inquiry).

dado

even if the story is true "as such", reading a "fall" and original sin into it is a much later interpretation completely at odds with the thinking and beliefs of the very people who wrote and preserved the story. Jews do not accept the concept of original sin, there is no such thing, the idea that a human should consider him/herself as starting of "tainted" is, frankly, a revolting concept.

fallingblood

If humans are born into sin, what happens if they die at birth? They, being borned into sin, would be sentenced to hell, that's if hell exists. I can't beleive that because God is supposed to be loving.
I think the Adam and Eve story is just a story. Something to warn us that we should listen to God, but while listening to him, they will be temptations. The temptations can then lead to death.

Bracer

Sorry to jump in here, because I have nothing of any real substance to add, but I second hezekiah's -- reminds me of that great soliloquy from The Simpsons:

"The following story is true. By which I mean it's false. It's all lies. But they're entertaining lies, and does that not in fact reveal a greater truth? The answer, is no..."

Chili

Yes I see your confusion but I am trying to tell you that these same facts that are presented in the allegory can and must become ours through understanding. I think the purpose of the allegory is to present us with a vague image of this aspect of truth so it will be with us untill we recognize it in real life and at that time find complete and full understanding of its meaning. Until then it remains a hidden truth that lies even beyond the reach of science.

I should add here that the book of Genesis belongs to a mystery religion wherein the mystery of faith must answer these kind of questions to the believer.

Chili

That's because it took 4000 years for salvation to be presented as fact in Christendom. The mythmakers were gnostic and knew exactly what they were writing.

The idea that humans are tainted is revolting but that is your interpretation and therefore your problem. In Catholicism we think that our fallen nature makes us human and earthly. This being the case we must be considerate and caring towards our fellow humans while at the same time we are given the freedom to make the most of life because that is the only time we have to 'color' our own heaven.

Chili

. . . or maybe your idea of heaven and hell is wrong.

Chili

If there are no allegories there the Simpsons will fade away.

fallingblood

Chili- what would be a right idea about hell?

FordMadoxBrown

Hello, Prof, my view of the Adam and Eve story is that it is a legend designed to illustrate or embody a truth about Hebrew man and His God. It wasn't intended for Christianity, but the Christians took it as appropriate to their needs, as they did with many parts of the OT.

The purpose of the story is to show how man fell out with God, by doing what he wanted to do instead a of keeping in line with God. It is a constant theme of the Hebrew Scriptures that the hebrews need to get back in line with God, and of course this idea also was taken over by Christianity for their own ends.

Your original questions seem to imagine that there is no middle ground between something being absoloute historical fact, and its being a pointless tale. On the contrary, most of the Bible falls in between these extremes.