Freethought & Rationalism Archive

brighid · 10-28-2003, 01:23 PM

Quote:

The Entity

I made the mistake of watching that movie alone, and toward the end of the movie there was a distant, but loud crashing noise proceeded by a loss of electricity in my home (the whole neighborhood I discovered.) I don't think I have ever been so scared in my life! Turned out, a car crash a few blocks away, caused the sudden power outage!

Brighid

Marduk · 10-28-2003, 04:05 PM

Check out the �poltergeist machine�

http://www.nexusmagazine.com/Polter.html

�Basically, what Hutchison did was cram into a single room a variety of devices which emit electromagnetic fields (such as Tesla coils, van de Graaff generators, RF transmitters, signal generators, etc.). He found that after they had been running for a while, effects began to occur that were identical to what have come to be regarded as poltergeist phenomena. Objects of any material levitated into the air and hovered there, or moved about and then fell; fires started in unlikely places around the building; a mirror smashed at a distance of 80 feet away; metal distorted and broke; water spontaneously swirled in containers; lights appeared in the air and then vanished; metal became white-hot but did not burn any surrounding materials; and so on�

MrFurious76 · 10-28-2003, 10:58 PM

Wasn't there also an experiment done recently where low frequency sound was directed at people and at the end of the experiment those who were exposed to the low frequency sounds experienced all sorts of creeped out "i'm being watched..." scary feelings?

From my own personal level, I was a grad assistant doing paranormal research at my university. Primarily ESP.....and yep we didn't find a darn thing. We had some statistically amazing events, but never could repeat them. So even if there was some ability going on the people using it couldn't harness it which makes it fairly useless. When we plotted every subjects score we got a textbook perfect bell curve

ps418 · 10-29-2003, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrFurious76
[B]Wasn't there also an experiment done recently where low frequency sound was directed at people and at the end of the experiment those who were exposed to the low frequency sounds experienced all sorts of creeped out "i'm being watched..." scary feelings?

Yep. Maybe that explains why I feel the urge to kill people who drive past my house at 3am with their car stereo's bass cranked up to 130 decibels?

Guerrilla · 11-01-2003, 09:19 AM

BUMP

I still have yet to receive a concise answer. Some links to videos or pictures would be nice.

Luther Maze · 11-01-2003, 11:25 AM

Here's a video of the Hutchison effect if you need an example of scientific explanations.

Nice link ps418. Mix that infrasound with insecurity and want for companionship and guildance and you can see why people are so easily drawn to the church. That feeling of doom really helps the priest drive home his doom message and the feeling of another 'presents' in the room i.e. god.
I'm likeing this site better every day.

copiae · 11-01-2003, 05:33 PM

Off Topic: Hmm... the Hutchinson Effect article was a great read. thanks for the link!

The Lone Ranger · 11-01-2003, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Guerrilla
My question to you is; has there ever in the history of video documentation, been any filmed footage of paranormal activity? Has there ever been any compelling video footage of a ghost, demon, providence or fairy proven to be valid? Is there any unfeigned footage that may even suggest the existence of the supernatural?

No.

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Or are we just left to believe the testimony of the people who think they may have saw this or that?

Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence.

Cheers,

Michael

The Lone Ranger · 11-01-2003, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Luther Maze
Here's a video of the Hutchison effect if you need an example of scientific explanations.

I find this extremely unlikely. A brief search turned up no mentions of the Hutchison Effect in any peer-reviewed science journals. If such a thing existed, you'd think a lot of people would be very interested in studying it, as it seems to violate a number of physical laws.

It's not like it's difficult to make fake videos, especially with today's technology.

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First of all, the Hutchison Effect is a collection of phenomena which were discovered accidentally by John Hutchison during attempts to study the longitudinal waves of Tesla back in 1979.

First warning flag: people have been claiming (with a total lack of evidence) that Tesla discovered all sorts of weird phenomena like anti-gravity for decades. A lot of people in the fringe-science movement seem to think that you can "justify" just about any claim, no matter how ridiculous, by linking it to Tesla.

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The Hutchison Effect occurs as the result of radio wave interferences in a zone of spatial volume encompassed by high voltage sources, usually a Van de Graff generator, and two or more Tesla coils.

This is just so much hand-waving. It is not anything even remotely resembling an actual attempt to explain the alleged phenomenon; it's simply a description of the circumstance under which it supposedly appears. The title of this article promises an explanation of the Hutchison Effect, but no such explanation is given or even attempted.

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The effects produced include levitation of heavy objects, fusion of dissimilar materials such as metal and wood (exactly as portrayed in the movie, "The Philadelphia Experiment"), the anomalous heating of metals without burning adjacent material, spontaneous fracturing of metals (which separate by sliding in a sideways fashion), and both temporary and permanent changes in the crystalline structure and physical properties of metals.

This effect produces such utterly dissimilar effects on such a wide variety of materials? That seems unlikely, to say the least.

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The levitation of heavy objects by the Hutchison Effect is not---repeat not---the result of simple electrostatic or electromagnetic levitation. Claims that these forces alone can explain the phenomenon are patently ridiculous, and easily disproved by merely trying to use such methods to duplicate what the Hutchison Effect has achieved, which has been well documented both on film and videotape, and has been witnessed many times by numerous credentialed scientists and engineers.

Conveniently, these numerous credentialed scientists and engineers are not named. I want to see this phenomenon demonstrated live in front of James Randi.

How, exactly, are electromagnetic fields supposed to cause non-magnetic objects to levitate? If, as the claimants insist, this is not a case of giving the object a very high electrostatic charge and causing it to "levitate" because it's repelled by something else with a similar charge, how on Earth is this "levitation" supposed to be accomplished? Magic? That's sure what it sounds like.

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Challengers should note that their apparatus must be limited to the use of 75 Watts of power from a 120 Volt AC outlet, as that is all that is used by Hutchison's apparatus to levitate a 60-pound cannon ball.

Cannon balls conduct electricity quite well. Perhaps they did "levitate" it with electromagnetic fields, despite their claims to the contrary. In any event, according to a physics board I checked, attempts to duplicate Hutchison's "results" have failed. Something seems fishy here.

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In a striking and baffling contradiction, dissimilar substances can simply "come together," yet the individual substances do not dissociate. A block of wood can simply "sink into" a metal bar, yet neither the metal bar nor the block of wood come apart. Also, there is no evidence of displacement, such as would occur if, for example, one were to sink a stone into a bowl of water.

Physics 101: Two particles of matter cannot simultaneously occupy the same space. Something's seriously fishy here.

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The anomalous heating of metal without any evidence of burning or scorching of the adjacent materials (usually wood) is a clear indication that possibly the nature of heat may not be completely understood.

Heat is energy. Heat radiates. Metals, in particular, tend to radiate heat energy quite effectively. If you can heat metal to a high temperature without it radiating away heat to its surroundings, you've disproved the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics. [You'd think this would have made the news.]

On the other hand, it's true that you can quickly and easily heat metals with electromagnetic radiation (that's why you're advised not to put metallic objects into your microwave). So long as you don't heat them too much, they won't get hot-enough to scorch nearby wood or paper. Big deal. Ever sat on an iron park bench on a sunny summer's day? It absorbs electromagnetic energy (we call it light) from the sun and gets plenty hot, but generally not hot-enough to ignite paper.

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It should be noted that the entirety of thermodynamics is represented by the infrared portion of the electromagnetic spectrum, which is insignificant in a context of 0 Hz to infinite Hz.

Nonsense. Utter tripe.

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Some temporary changes in the crystalline structure and physical properties of metals are somewhat reminiscent of the "spoon bending" of Uri Geller, except that there is no one near the metal samples when the changes take place.

*Big* Warning Sign! Uri Geller was shown to be a fraud a long time ago. Anyone who takes him seriously isn't exactly the most trustworthy of sources.

Long story short: I think this almost certainly a bunch of baloney.

Cheers,

Michael

Luther Maze · 11-01-2003, 09:26 PM

The fact that it didn't make the news was one of the first things that made me think it to be a conspiracy theory. But then again I think the goverment doesn't tell use a lot of things for our own protection or to protect the governments interest. I try not to get into conspiracy theories myself but they can be an addiction.
Either was it's a fun read. This coming from someone who watches the X-files from time to time.

The Lone Ranger
Do you know of some good sites for keeping up with such scientific research?
Howstuffworks is the only site I stumbled across thus far. I'm going to go on over and see what I can find.

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10-28-2003, 04:05 PM	#12
Marduk Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: the 10th planet Posts: 5,065	Check out the �poltergeist machine� http://www.nexusmagazine.com/Polter.html �Basically, what Hutchison did was cram into a single room a variety of devices which emit electromagnetic fields (such as Tesla coils, van de Graaff generators, RF transmitters, signal generators, etc.). He found that after they had been running for a while, effects began to occur that were identical to what have come to be regarded as poltergeist phenomena. Objects of any material levitated into the air and hovered there, or moved about and then fell; fires started in unlikely places around the building; a mirror smashed at a distance of 80 feet away; metal distorted and broke; water spontaneously swirled in containers; lights appeared in the air and then vanished; metal became white-hot but did not burn any surrounding materials; and so on�

10-28-2003, 10:58 PM	#13
MrFurious76 Regular Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Charleston, IL Posts: 153	Wasn't there also an experiment done recently where low frequency sound was directed at people and at the end of the experiment those who were exposed to the low frequency sounds experienced all sorts of creeped out "i'm being watched..." scary feelings? From my own personal level, I was a grad assistant doing paranormal research at my university. Primarily ESP.....and yep we didn't find a darn thing. We had some statistically amazing events, but never could repeat them. So even if there was some ability going on the people using it couldn't harness it which makes it fairly useless. When we plotted every subjects score we got a textbook perfect bell curve

11-01-2003, 09:19 AM	#15
Guerrilla Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 72	BUMP I still have yet to receive a concise answer. Some links to videos or pictures would be nice.

11-01-2003, 11:25 AM	#16
Luther Maze Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Tampa Fl. USA Posts: 24	Here's a video of the Hutchison effect if you need an example of scientific explanations. Nice link ps418. Mix that infrasound with insecurity and want for companionship and guildance and you can see why people are so easily drawn to the church. That feeling of doom really helps the priest drive home his doom message and the feeling of another 'presents' in the room i.e. god. I'm likeing this site better every day.

11-01-2003, 05:33 PM	#17
copiae Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 288	Off Topic: Hmm... the Hutchinson Effect article was a great read. thanks for the link!

11-01-2003, 09:26 PM	#20
Luther Maze Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Tampa Fl. USA Posts: 24	The fact that it didn't make the news was one of the first things that made me think it to be a conspiracy theory. But then again I think the goverment doesn't tell use a lot of things for our own protection or to protect the governments interest. I try not to get into conspiracy theories myself but they can be an addiction. Either was it's a fun read. This coming from someone who watches the X-files from time to time. The Lone Ranger Do you know of some good sites for keeping up with such scientific research? Howstuffworks is the only site I stumbled across thus far. I'm going to go on over and see what I can find.

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