Freethought & Rationalism Archive

rcscwc · 07-20-2009, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

Brahmi may have been derived from either Phoenician or Aramaic.

Brahmi has 48 characters, Aramic only 22. Same for Hebrew and Phenician. Seems 22 is the upper limit of sounds in those languages.

Devanagari, with 52 characters, is a successor of Brahmi, many characters are strikingly similar. Consonants in both are arranged in groups of 5, in the same order.

The Brahmi script was the ancestor of all South Asian writing systems. In addition, many East and Southeast Asian scripts, such as Burmese, Thai, Tibetan, and even Japanese to a very small extent (vowel order), were also ultimately derived from the Brahmi script. Thus the Brahmi script was the Indian equivalent of the Greek script that gave arise to a host of different systems.

mountainman · 07-20-2009, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamJoseph

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

The Nag Hammadi Codices have been carbon dated to 348 CE (+/- 60 y).
Many commentators, thinking that the "Early Christian Action" happened
prior to the fourth century try and argue that the texts inside this
series of 12,13 books may have been authored well before the 4th CE.

The text "The Acts of Peter and the 12 Apostles" which explicitly
mentions that the christian apostle Peter carried around with him
a book, the cover of which was similar to the cover of the book
which was being carried around by the main character of the story,
the Pearl Man Lithargoel, whom everyone thinks MUST BE JESUS,
cannot have been authored until the age of the codex.

This to me suggests that the author of TAOPATTA was living
in the fourth century, as the carbon dating of the physical codex
in which the story is contained itself suggests.

It is disturbing there is no proof of anything in the Gospels - even for the sake of what are totally genuine believing christians, and even for the terrible things inflicted upon others by this scripture's allegations. It is an absurd situation which has plunged humanity into chaos and wars and the same is reflected in Islamic scriptures. Everywhere these two religious doctrines stepped there were horrific mass murders.

The first step taken by Constantine and Muhhamad in the protection
of their own authodoxy was to order the death penalty and arrange
the executions of satirists. Both followed the precedent set
by Ardashir c.222 CE to "canonize a Holy Writ".

Quote:

For me, this codex does not mean anything whatsoever - the fact it is alledgly claimed to be written by Jews, means only a Hebrew document of the contemorary kind, with authors named who can be historically identified, will suffice.

The authorship was preserved by Pachomonian monks
at the nearby monastery. These people were refugees
from Constantinianism in the fourth century. These
people preserved the books of heretics. They were
certainly not Jewish, they wrote in Coptic and from
a greek original. The authors were clever academic
Alexandrians - the author was greek.

Quote:

There is no excuse for no proof whatsoever of anything claimed in the Gospels considering the period of its setting.

Julian claimed the fabrication of the christians was a fiction.
Perhaps there is some truth in his claim?

IamJoseph · 07-21-2009, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcscwc

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

Brahmi may have been derived from either Phoenician or Aramaic.

Brahmi has 48 characters, Aramic only 22. Same for Hebrew and Phenician. Seems 22 is the upper limit of sounds in those languages.

Devanagari, with 52 characters, is a successor of Brahmi, many characters are strikingly similar. Consonants in both are arranged in groups of 5, in the same order.

The Brahmi script was the ancestor of all South Asian writing systems. In addition, many East and Southeast Asian scripts, such as Burmese, Thai, Tibetan, and even Japanese to a very small extent (vowel order), were also ultimately derived from the Brahmi script. Thus the Brahmi script was the Indian equivalent of the Greek script that gave arise to a host of different systems.

The lesser number of alphabets signifies a more advanced system. Of note is the pristine inclusion of vowels and numerals inclusive in the 22 hebrew alphabets, able to dispense the greatest prose with the least words, and conduct a scientific cencus in the millions. It takes 4 alphabets for the Greek and Latin to write '17', while it takes 2 in the Hebrew: which is the more advanced?

IamJoseph · 07-21-2009, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

They were
certainly not Jewish, they wrote in Coptic and from
a greek original. The authors were clever academic
Alexandrians - the author was greek.

Unless I'm wrong, the coptics are the more original Egyptians, and the Arabs are the new comers in this region - the latter appearing after the Greek invasion of Babylon, circa 500 BCE, and took over Egypt from the Coptics by force. Both the ancient Egyptians and the Coptics are not Arab.

IamJoseph · 07-23-2009, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldo

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

The Church History is available online. It was written in Greek by Eusebius between the years of c.312 and c.337 CE, primary completed c.324 with a number of revisions to c.339 CE. The usual "Once Upon a time opening takes the following form ....

An equally valid alternative to the Eusebius Fiction Postulate (EFP) is the Hindu Prank Postulate (HPP). Apparently after Alexander the Great conquered much of the known world the Hindus began a long term plan of seeking revenge against the west. They began by recruiting certain members of the lost tribe of Israel who were residing in India at the time and committed the entire OT to memory. Once achieving this the Hindus created a dialectic approach to scripture to abolish the judaic law. Once satisfied that they have achieved their goals the Hindu masters waited centuries until the astrological signs were in place and in fact were the magi who came from the east. The treasure they brought was the christ child whom they identified as shiva. Many miracles which were attributed to Christ were in fact the result of advanced tantric energy destroying the illusion of sickness. The alleged death of Christ was equally an illusion as Lognius used a spear filled with blood to "fake" piercing the side of Christ. In a deep self induced coma Christ was placed in tomb which functioned like an artificial respirator. Once revived Christ and his disciples fled back to India where they lived long and peacful lives.

Tantric energy with a dash of Gospel truth proves how bad the Jews really are.

Isn't it always a safe bet to blame the Jews? If the Gospels was true - the Jews are the bad guys - but if its not true - the Jews are the bad guys.

arnoldo · 07-25-2009, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamJoseph

There is no excuse for no proof whatsoever of anything claimed in the Gospels considering the period of its setting.

Julian claimed the fabrication of the christians was a fiction.
Perhaps there is some truth in his claim?

You know, the Emperor Julian was realizing, rather too late, that the christian religion was a seed planted by the hindu gnostics to destroy the Roman Empire from within. Allegorically these ascended masters left clues of the superiority of Eastern thought over western thought in various gnostic writings including the Gospel of Thomas, note the following passage from the gThomas which describes the East as having "light", i.e, knowledge while the west (symbolized as Egypt much like babylon symbolized rome) is the "serpent."

Quote:

1 When I was an infant child

in the palace of my Father

2 and resting in the wealth and luxury of my nurturers,

out of the East, our native country, my parents provisioned me and sent me.

4 And of the wealth of those their treasures they put together a load

5 both great and light, that I might carry it alone.

6 Gold is the load, of them that are above (or of the land of the Ellaeans or Gilaeans),

and silver of the great treasures (or of Gazzak the great)

7 and stones, chalcedonies from the Indians

and pearls from the Kosani (Kushan).

8 And they armed me with adamant

9 and they took off from me (Gr. put on me) the garment set with gems, spangled with gold, which they had made for me because they loved me

10 and the robe that was yellow in hue, made for my stature.

11 And they made a covenant with me, and inscribed it on mine understanding, that I should forget it, and said:

12 If thou go down into Egypt, and bring back thence the one pearl

13 which is there girt about by the devouring serpent

http://www.earlychristianwritings.co...ctsthomas.html

That the serpent is symbolic of the west is emphasized by the addition of Mark 16 which is a clever satire on how the hindus were able to handle the "serpent", i.e, the eastern spread of the roman empire, by planting a pacifistic ideology within the roman empire.

mountainman · 07-25-2009, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldo

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

Julian claimed the fabrication of the christians was a fiction.
Perhaps there is some truth in his claim?

...[trimmed]...

Allegorically these ascended masters left clues of the superiority of Eastern thought over western thought in various gnostic writings ....

One of which has got to be this quote

Vivekananda While travelling from England to India in January 1897, on board the ship Prinz-Regent Luitpold, the venerable sage Vivekananda told Nivedita about his dream of an old bearded man named Therapeutae, (Theraputra - son [putra] of an old monk [thera]) who had asked:

"Do ye come to effect our restoration? I am one of the ancient order of Therapeutae The truths preached by us have been given out by Christians as taught by Jesus; but for the matter of that, there was no personality by the name of Jesus ever born".

- Extracted from Vivekananda's autobiography.
Cited by Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy; and Narasingha Prosad Sil

This account preserved by the Hindu sage totally agrees with history
as presented in which Jesus is a fiction introduced by Constantine in
the fourth century, at which time the predominant religion was the
Hellenistic traditions preserved by the Therapeutae of Asclepius.

Which most ancient church and temple of the Opposing Religions
did Constantine take pains to pointedly utterly destroy prior to Nicaea?
The most ancient and most highly revered temple of Asclepius at Aegae.
Read about the account in Eusebius' "Life of Bullneck".

premjan · 07-25-2009, 08:15 PM

Could have been a sort of morality play written by someone. Then this may have been true of other prophets / teachers.

mountainman · 07-26-2009, 06:10 PM

The Acts of Peter and the Twelve Apostles is a morality play.
It is a morality play which was sealed inside a time capsule from c.348 CE
The teachers featured in this text are two.
(1) Peter - the heavy and dull stone of the church of the name of Jesus.
(2) Lithargoel - the light glistening stone of the established physicians' league

Who does the teaching?
Who mentions what the Gita mentions?

rcscwc · 08-01-2009, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamJoseph

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcscwc

Brahmi has 48 characters, Aramic only 22. Same for Hebrew and Phenician. Seems 22 is the upper limit of sounds in those languages.

Devanagari, with 52 characters, is a successor of Brahmi, many characters are strikingly similar. Consonants in both are arranged in groups of 5, in the same order.

The Brahmi script was the ancestor of all South Asian writing systems. In addition, many East and Southeast Asian scripts, such as Burmese, Thai, Tibetan, and even Japanese to a very small extent (vowel order), were also ultimately derived from the Brahmi script. Thus the Brahmi script was the Indian equivalent of the Greek script that gave arise to a host of different systems.

The lesser number of alphabets signifies a more advanced system. Of note is the pristine inclusion of vowels and numerals inclusive in the 22 hebrew alphabets, able to dispense the greatest prose with the least words, and conduct a scientific cencus in the millions. It takes 4 alphabets for the Greek and Latin to write '17', while it takes 2 in the Hebrew: which is the more advanced?

Lols. A cript with ZERO number of characters should be the ultimate adavanced one.

No, a script should be able to represent as many sounds as possible, even with subtle differences.

Brahmi and other later Indian scripts can represent all sounds available even in Hebrew. Otherway round is just not possible, even with Roman. Any Indian language transliterated into Roman has to depend so much on add on dicritical symbols that they become incomprehensible without a key.

Indian scripts are easily customised too. Quite a few characters have been customised. For example, Devanagri has no symbol for z, but a dot under j symbol has been introduced without hiccups.

Then there is grammar too. Indian laguages are backed by a strong grammar, derived from Panini.

PS: In every Indian laguage system 17 requires ONLY 2 symbols.

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07-25-2009, 08:15 PM	#48
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	Could have been a sort of morality play written by someone. Then this may have been true of other prophets / teachers.

07-26-2009, 06:10 PM	#49
mountainman Contributor Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Falls Creek, Oz. Posts: 11,192	The Acts of Peter and the Twelve Apostles is a morality play. It is a morality play which was sealed inside a time capsule from c.348 CE The teachers featured in this text are two. (1) Peter - the heavy and dull stone of the church of the name of Jesus. (2) Lithargoel - the light glistening stone of the established physicians' league Who does the teaching? Who mentions what the Gita mentions?

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