Originally Posted by Gundulf

Now look, if you're going to hypothetically allow the existence of the miracle, you've got to be consistent with it. An omniscient, omnipotent God that has the power to split the waters to let 40,000 people through.

But this omniscient, omnipotent God forgot that the riverbed would be a bit muddy? Thus sayeth the Lord: "Oops."


This reminds me of someone arguing against that miracle where God stopped the sun for an hour - I heard someone arguing, "That couldn't have happened! If God had stopped the earth suddenly so that the sun appeared to have stood still, the sudden halt in the earth's rotation would have sent everything flying!"

Right. If there were a God omnipotent enough to negate the laws of physics enough to stop the earth rotating, you've got to grant that this omnipotent God would also likely have the ability to negate the laws of inertia, too.

Originally Posted by Mageth

BTW, an omni God like you describe would also have the ability to instantly vaporize the Hebrew's enemies

Originally Posted by Roller

But what if they had iron chariots?

Originally Posted by Sven

Which can of course be "explained" by even more miracles (which for some reason Moses forgot to mention).

Originally Posted by Mageth

The writer believed the sun rotated around the earth, and didn't know the earth rotated on its axis. Hence, the writer had no problem with the sun stopping, as it would not cause a sudden deceleration on the earth's surface.

BTW, an omni God like you describe would also have the ability to instantly vaporize the Hebrew's enemies or just cause them to all dropp dead (and there would be no need in doing so to stop the earth's rotation and negate the laws of physics to keep everyone from being hurled around), or "teleport" the Hebrews across the Red Sea (thus negating the need to push back cubic miles of water and dry up the muddy seafloor). Biblical "OmniGod" is not portrayed as a God who uses his powers to the full "omni" extent, or as taking the "easy way out" by performing the actually less complicated supernatural solutions, for some reason. I'll part the sea, but you have to walk. I'll stop the sun, but you'll have to fight.

Originally Posted by AnEvilNumber333

I have come up with a new way to discredit the bible. Logistics.

Originally Posted by AnEvilNumber333

Hi All

I have come up with a new way to discredit the bible. Logistics.

Take any random story (in this case moses leading the jews out of egypt).
Assume the miracles to be true and do not question them.
Look at what is being achieved and ask the question, how.

OK, so we have to move 40,000 slaves out of egypt, through the red sea into the promised land. Additionally, there is the problem of being persued by an army with horses and chariots, that left not long after we did.

Our 40,000 slaves include, women, children, old, sick and injured. Additionally, food must be transported, along with water. This must be sufficient for around 40 years (we got a little lost), but to be fair, let us say provissions for 1 month.

A competent and fit hiker could move 20Km per day with kit, but clearly, this needs to be adjusted. I would guess that the whole ponderous column could move no faster than 10Km per day and that is being generous.

Having established the maximum rate of travel, we can begin to see that the journey must have taken some time. Before reaching the red sea, a couple of days in the desert. The narrowest point of the red sea that can be crossed without requiring a crossing of other notable bodies of water is 120Km (We can assume this because the Bible does not report Moses parting 2 seas, just one). This leads us to think that quite a few nights (12) were spent camping in the red sea.

All of this time, the army is marching trying to catch up. We may assume safely that the army is marching somewhat quicker that the column of jews. Let us assume 12Km.

It is rather important to note that this means that it would take the army a mere 5 days to catch the jews had they departed 1 day after. The bible indicates that the army was dispatched somewhat sooner.

OK, so now, logistically, it would be impossible to escape from egypt with a persuing army, and a 1 day head start would be caught in less time than it took to cross the red sea, let alone the journey to get there.

Please feel free to use logistics to wipe any other aspects of biblical tripe from the face of this planet. And note, I even allowed the miracle to be present and functioning without any questions. Interesting.

Another point, slightly tangentical, how come there are no modern testaments. I mean, did god just give up after his son was offed by the ROMANS not JEWS. (Yes the jews did not do it, the romans, head of the church killed their own god... Hahahahaha. I find that really funny). Or has no one done anything worthy of writing about in a biblical sense. I submit the inquisition should have its own chapter.

Originally Posted by WishboneDawn

No. You came up with a way to discredit a certain (literal) view of the bible.