Originally Posted by seebs

I admit that my fascination with "carnal needs" comes from a Jewish teacher, but I still think it's an important and valuable part of the Christian faith.

People who are hungry from lack of food are typically unconcerned with theology. They would like some food, really.

We were told to meet those needs too. I don't think it's optional.



This would also happen if you were walking away from Christ and just being more and more of a jerk to people.

There are many people who fear me or oppose me, for whatever reasons, but I don't think I have any enemies. What's an enemy? An enemy, someone I am commanded to love, is just a friend I haven't gotten to know well enough yet.



Are you sure they are watering down the message, and not preaching a stronger message that just happens to be different?

I agree that some churches focus too much on "gaining converts". However, there is a place for such things within a mature church.



If I ever meet someone in my church with that problem, yes, I'd ask. And no, I wouldn't lose my job. Of course, if I asked it, they could be sure it was a genuinely loving concern, because they would have experience of my pattern of concerned and supportive behavior. I wouldn't be demanding that they imagine that I am loving despite evidence to the contrary.

Thus far, it hasn't come up, though.

I do regularly confront people on sins. Now, I maybe don't do it the same way you do, but I do it, and perhaps more importantly, it works.

You say, quite correctly, that it is the Spirit which convicts. However, it is the Spirit which moves us. So by accepting the leadings we receive, we participate in this most necessary role.

Originally Posted by Bible John

Yes maybe so then I will quote matt 28

Originally Posted by Bible John

Your statements about enemies I think are valid. The bible certainly does command to love our enemies and those that persecute us.

But

You say, quite correctly, that it is the Spirit which convicts. However, it is the Spirit which moves us. So by accepting the leadings we receive, we participate in this most necessary role.

John 16:7 But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.
John 16:8 When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment:

Originally Posted by SaintCog

Are we playing the "copy and paste random Bible verses" game. cool!

"These men are not drunk, as you suppose, for it is only nine o'clock in the morning" (Acts 2.15).

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the worst argument ever devised.

Originally Posted by Bible John

The world should hate the true disciples.

Originally Posted by Nice Squirrel

Actually the world tends to hate self-righteous jerks. You do know that all cults (Religious, psychological, and business) including use this (everyone will hate you) thinking to reinforce their membership from questioning any straying from official doctrine?

Why does one have to be a self-righteous jerk to teach the word? I noticed you passage was not about hating true believers, but people who do not fit in with the world because they are different from the prevailing society, (specifically his disciples). Jesus is also refering to specific events (hence the past tense) -- Read the entire story incontext not cherry picked verses that support your self-aggrandising stance.

BTW, You still haven't given reason why your church doesn't do personalized works of charity.

I must get ready for liberal church now. We are going to have a pagan orgy during the litergy and afterwards we will feast on a BBQed virgin smothered in kitten sauce.

Originally Posted by Nice Squirrel

I must get ready for liberal church now. We are going to have a pagan orgy during the litergy and afterwards we will feast on a BBQed virgin smothered in kitten sauce.

Originally Posted by Bible John

What church do you attend?