aa5874

We cannot just continue year after year wasting time with people who do not want to accept the evidence from antiquity.

Josephus used the Septuagint the Greek Bible of Hebrew Scripture.

1. Antiquities of the Jews 20.9.1 was NOT written in English but in Greek and the Greek word is " Χριστοῦ"

1. 1 Samuel 16.6 in the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸς" and is translated in English as ANOINTED.

2. 1 Samuel 24.7 in the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸς" and is translated in English as ANOINTED.

3. 1 Samuel 26.9 in the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸν" and is translated to English as ANOINTED.

4. 1 Samuel 26.11 of the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸν" and is translated to English as ANOINTED.

5. 1 Samuel 26.16 of the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸν" and it is translated to English as ANOINTED.

6. 1 Samuel 26.23 in the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸν" and is translated to English as ANOINTED.

7. 2 Samuel 19.21 of the Septuagint contains the Greek word "χριστὸν" and it is translated to English as ANOINTED.

How many times must we go over the same thing.

1. Up to the 3rd century, Apologetic sources ADMITTED that Jews did not ever acknowledge or identified any character called Jesus the Messiah.

2. No story of Jesus the Messiah has been found and dated before c 70 CE.

3. No stories of his Cult has been found and dated before c 70 CE.

4. Josephus, Tacitus and Suetonius claimed Vespasian was the prophesied Messianic ruler in Hebrew Scripture.

5. Jesus Christ was the Son of a Ghost and God the Creator in the Bible.

6. No author of the Canon even claimed they personally met or saw Jesus Christ, the Messianic ruler.

7. Paul claimed his Jesus Christ was REVEALED by God.

8. Christian and Apologetic authors of antiquity like Ignatius, Justin, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Aristides, Clement, Origen, Eusebius, and Jerome claimed Jesus was the Son of a Ghost, with the seed of a Spirit.

9. Christian and Apologetic writers that used Josephus claimed Jesus was the Son of Ghost--born without sexual union.

10. Christian and Apologetic writers that used the NT claimed Jesus was born of a Ghost.

Let us move on.

Jesus was a Myth character.

The "biography" of Jesus, the Son of a Ghost, has been published and well documented in the Roman Empire for hundreds of years.

stephan huller

FWIW there are Greek manuscripts of the Books of Samuel where χρηστός appears in the place of χριστὸν. No one can explain it at least to my satisfaction.

Sheshbazzar

It Greek. Its the intrusions of pagan Hellenism. It doesn't have to make any sense, simply slop the swine.

Toto

Wells does not take that exact position. He seems to think that there was a Galilean miracle-worker/cynic sage preacher who provided some of the sayings in Q.

He provides some fairly cogent arguments for viewing the phase "called Christ" as an interpolation. For you to dismiss them as merely "convenient" seems rather petty.
James is identified as the brother of Jesus, and there was another Jesus mentioned in that section. (answering your later objection that both James and Jesus were common names.)

There is also the possibility that in adding "called Christ" the interpolator removed another identification.

But "called Christ" is in Matthew, which a Christian scribe would know. And we are talking about a brief marginal gloss.

So how do you make sense of this from a historicist perspective? Jesus had a brother James who was an important Jewish figure in Jerusalem, important enough to be killed for political reasons in 62 CE. Could this Jewish person have had a brother who was killed around 30 CE at the age of 30? Could this brother have been a Galilean peasant? What happened in the 30 years between 30 and 62 CE? How did James get from the Galilean village to Jerusalem? The whole scenario makes no sense. It makes much more sense to see this as a Christian scribe seeing the name Jesus and trying to connect it to his Lord and Savior.

spin

I also argue that τον αδελφον Ιησου του λεγομενου Χριστου is a simple marginal gloss of a scribe aware of the developments in Origen's Contra Celsus and his commentary on Matthew, in which Origen, unaware that Josephus doesn't ascribe the fall of Jerusalem to the death of James, connects the James mentioned in Josephus to Jesus, following Hegesippus (a name confused with Josephus), as indicated in Eusebius E.H. 2.23. The scribe found a reference to "the brother of Jesus, the one called christ" attributed to Josephus in Origen, but didn't find it in his copy of Josephus, and so places the phrase in the margin, near the description of James's death, where it should have been.

tanya

Thanks for this question.

1. Can you provide two links?

2. For the two phrases you envision, one with χρηστός, the other with χριστὸν, could you please give us both the original Hebrew (including the version) and the roman letter transliteration, plus the English.

In my opinion, the Hebrew version, by way of illustration, in 1 Samuel 2:10
refers to anointment, per se, whereas, in 1 Samuel 2:35
the same word, mashiakh, in my garbled transliteration, corresponds more to the idea of "holy one", as seen here, in this translation

Duvduv

Do you mean to tell me that "Josephus," who was allegedly a priest who served in the Temple and was a follower of rabbinic Judaism couldn't read Hebrew and had to rely on a Greek translation?!

sotto voce

'No longer will a man teach his neighbour, or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord,' because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest," declares the Lord. "Because I will forgive their wickedness, and will remember their sins no more." Jeremiah 31:34

aa5874

Do you mean that you know Josephus had a Hebrew Bible written in the Hebrew language in his possession when he wrote Antiquities of the Jews??

jdboy

What? Of course Josephus tells us that Titus gave him the Torah. Don't you believe Josephus?