dmarker

As I said before. Humanity is like a thirty year old person who has completely forgotten the first 22 years of life and has memory problems for the next seven years. We've only been keeping accurate records from the last few centuries. Before that the records got spottier and spottier, then they disappear altogether.

That does not preclude written communication. Since I have no evidence the following is rank speculation. Perhaps hunters and gatherers marked their territories with signs the equivilent to No Tresspassing or Welcome Stranger. Either is possible depending on the nature of their society. Perhaps they sent messages about game or an unusually large crop of edible plants. These could have been pretty simple. Unfortunately we must stick to speculation.

RevDahlia

Certain people participating in this thread have no idea how to use the quote feature.

The quote feature is useful because it indicates to bystanders what one has cut-and-pasted from previous posts, versus what one has come up with one's own self.

So please, kids: if you are QUOTING from a previous post, use the QUOTE TAGS.

Here's how you do it: whenever you're cutting-and-pasting text from another user, type {quote} before you place the text in your post, and {/quote} after. Except use square brackets [] instead of curlicues {}.

That is all. But it is important if you want people to pay attention to what you're saying.

Chris Weimer

hmm... I can't seem to find it now, but actually they found egyptian writing that predated or equated with Harappa. This is brand new, at most a month or two old. Anyone seen anything?

Oikoman

If you count pictograms, totem poles, and other ceremonial artwork, you can extend the number of 'documents' that originated in N. America... they aren't true writing, but they do serve the same purpose - to record information and allow it to be passed from generation to generation.

Perry5

I am so old that i have to take viagra four times a day just to keep from peeing in my sox and i can remember when a curser was someone who walked around swearing all of the time,coke was a cold drink,grass was something that you sat on at the park and gay ment happy.

(Is that old or what???)

gravitybow

This is a misattribution, giving the impression that Robert Gannon published his findings in Popular Science, when he is actually describing Robert Gentry and his halo theory:

In the creationist version of this citation, notice how the Gentry reference is sliced off and "dates" is capitalized, making the sentence start there. It's as if the writer knows that Gentry's research has fallen under much criticism, so let's make Gannon say it instead, but without the halos. Since the publication of the 1979 Popular Science article (we're certainly using current scholarship, aren't we), Gentry's theory has been refuted several times. Here's the talkorigins link, if you're interested.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/po-halos/gentry.html

spanner365

[qoute]Which claim are you refering to? China, Sumer, Old Europe, Atlantis?
Without knowing which site you are talking about I can't answer this. Offhand I can't think of any modern work where this is true.

[/quote]The very first civilization which has ever lived in Iran was The Shoosh Civilization.
8000 years ago, there was a civilization which lived in today's Khoozestan, their name was "Shoosh Civilization," or in English "Susa Civilization." So far this has been reported as the oldest civilization which have ever existed on Earth. By civilization, we mean civilized city government or city state or Empire or Kingdom or any type of local civilized system. Archeologists divide time periods & discoveries of Shoosh, into two periods: Period One & Period Two. These periods are based on Geological Layers which the fossils & other material has been found in them, layer one & two which are on top of one another.


[qoute]Oh, they are reliable enough. Not all techniques can be applied to all sites. For instance, you may not have a good dendroochronology for a particular area, or you may not have material suitable for thermoluminescence. For instance, dendrochronology and C-14 are both used at Catal Huyuk.

[/quote]Is it at all possible that when finding rings on certain wooden creations and correlating these rings over several thousand years there may be a certain chance of error. Might this be the reason for the descrepancy in the opinion of the oldest civilization known to man?

I took in from the other posts that these languages were developed independantly. Are you assuming that language spread throughout the world quickly after it was first invented? What is the popular opinion on this?


Jericho is one of the most ancient human habitations. The most ancient human remains were found in it, some of which go back to 5000 years B.C. Others believe that these remains go back to 7000 years B.C. The most recent opinion on this subject is that they date back to 8000 years B.C.

It seems to me that there is a lot of discrepancy in these modern techniques. They do not agree with the original C14 dating.

TheEV1LGEN1US

Language spread? Are you talking about written language? You must because verbal language was never invented. Language is inherently wired in a human being. You cannot even think without language. And if you were to grow up not learning any language (like if you were left alone on an island as a little kid), you would make up your own language, complete with your own grammar and pronunciation rules.

Graculus

[QUOTE=spanner365The very first civilization which has ever lived in Iran was The Shoosh Civilization.
8000 years ago, there was a civilization which lived in today's Khoozestan, their name was "Shoosh Civilization," or in English "Susa Civilization." So far this has been reported as the oldest civilization which have ever existed on Earth. [/QUOTE]Please do not cut and paste without linking to the source. Your source is not reliable, to a great degree because English is not their first language. Shaghaghi.net seems to be the originator of this canard. It looks like they confused the earlier small agrarian settlements with the later (6000 BP) urban settlement.
There is no discrepancy, see above.
I think that you are misunderstanding the evidence, or you are using very bad sources. The first human habitations predate Jericho and everything else by hundreds of thousands of years. You have a continuum from small settlements through villages and townsites to cities. The early levels at Jericho are very old, but isn't a city or a civilization. perhaps this would be a good point to differentiate between "culture" and "civilization". "Culture" can refer to any shared social structure, even small nomadic bands of foragers can have a culture. "Civilization" rather specificly referes to a shift in society to an urban lifestyle. The early levels at Susa and Jericho are part of a culture, not a civilization. You get cities, that is large townsites with a shift to an urban lifestyle, at around 8000 BP (6000 BCE) in Eastern Europe and the Near East. Jericho is part of this early civilization, but before that it was a large village.
If you confine your research to pages from actual archeologists, you won't find that there is a problem. You can find anything you want to on the 'net if you aren't fussy about the source. The "forbidden archeology" people will tell you that there was an Atlantean civilization 20,000 years ago that used crystals to power vast technologies. Doesn't mean that they have a clue.

Kingreaper

But everyone knows the crystals were just to control it, not for power

for power they had ZPMs

:devil3: