Freethought & Rationalism Archive

offa · 12-24-2003, 05:24 PM

the star was joseph (the star of david). stars, earthquakes, fig trees, etc. are all human ... just like spirits, GOD, and angels.

Steven Carr · 12-24-2003, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bede
If the Star was anything, it was an unimpressive tous, but highly significant to an astrologer, conjunction of major planets such as the one that happened, IIRC, in April 4BC.

7 BC.

Conjunctions are pretty common. Presumably every time it happened, astrologers would have turned up in Jerusalem asking for the whereabouts of the new King.

-FAITH ALONE- · 12-24-2003, 07:55 PM

Yes the answer is in "The Star" by Arthur C. Clark

Toto · 12-24-2003, 08:09 PM

The Star.

Um, science fiction.

Krosis · 12-25-2003, 06:14 AM

Um.. no shit.

the point of mentioning it was "hey.. this is a possible scenario..."

-cheers

Kosh · 12-25-2003, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CX
Discussions like this irritate me. There is no reason to conclude that the infancy narratives are historically true. Consequently trying to find a "scientific" explanation for the star is like having a rational discussion about where the Simpsons live.

:notworthy :notworthy :notworthy

Toto · 12-25-2003, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Krosis
Um.. no shit.

the point of mentioning it was "hey.. this is a possible scenario..."

-cheers

Actually, if you read the link, a supernova is not a plausible scenario.

Quote:

Let�s assume, as many historians have, that the most likely time frame for the birth of Jesus was between 3 B.C. and A.D. 1. Let�s also assume that the Star of Bethlehem could be observed by skywatchers elsewhere in the world, and not just by the Magi � who are known as �wise men� or �kings� but were actually priests who relied on astrology.

These assumptions would rule out some of the prime suspects in the mystery: comets, brightening stars known as novae, and exploding stars known as supernovae. The Chinese, who did a particularly good job of cataloging astronomical phenomena, recorded no such phenomena during the years in question.

Beyond the timing issue, there�s another consideration: A comet or supernova big enough to attract the wise men�s attention would have been widely noticed by royalty and commoners as well. But King Herod and his advisers seemed not to know or care about the star until the astrologers from the east came to visit.

Arthur Clark is just playing with Christian emotions. What if producing that silly star that led to the Slaughter of the Innocents and all of the rest of the bloodshed in Christian history had required the destruction of an advanced civilization, one that was happy and never needed a blood sacrifice? What does that say about a putative God of the Universe? The Jesuit in the story had his faith shaken by this knowledge.

Family Man · 12-25-2003, 12:29 PM

Also consider this. Even if it was a supernova, it wouldn't shine over one place.

judge · 12-25-2003, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jerusha

This article is based on John Mosley�s 1987 book, �The Christmas Star,� which is available from the Griffith Observatory. �The Christmas Star� addresses many other questions about the season, such as: When was Christ born? Who were the Magi? Why is Christmas observed on Dec. 25?

Here is a short video presentation about this.....

http://askelm.com/video/real/xmas_star.swf

Primordial Groove · 12-25-2003, 06:19 PM

So, you are saying this could be a fable?!?

I think these 'wise men' would have written something to back the claim in the bible.
If I'm wise and get miracled into following a star and then give my gold and franken-sense to a stable savior, I think I would have written it down on tablet or papaya or something. Mentioning something like this to Ali next door wouldn't be out of the question.
Anything literary that backs this bible claim?

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12-24-2003, 05:24 PM	#11
offa Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Monroeville, Ohio, USA Posts: 440	the star was joseph (the star of david). stars, earthquakes, fig trees, etc. are all human ... just like spirits, GOD, and angels.

12-24-2003, 07:55 PM	#13
-FAITH ALONE- Regular Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: cincinatti Posts: 129	Yes the answer is in "The Star" by Arthur C. Clark

12-24-2003, 08:09 PM	#14
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	The Star. Um, science fiction.

12-25-2003, 06:14 AM	#15
Krosis Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: WWLLD? Posts: 2,237	Um.. no shit. the point of mentioning it was "hey.. this is a possible scenario..." -cheers

12-25-2003, 12:29 PM	#18
Family Man Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Superior, CO USA Posts: 1,553	Also consider this. Even if it was a supernova, it wouldn't shine over one place.

12-25-2003, 06:19 PM	#20
Primordial Groove Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 1,570	So, you are saying this could be a fable?!? I think these 'wise men' would have written something to back the claim in the bible. If I'm wise and get miracled into following a star and then give my gold and franken-sense to a stable savior, I think I would have written it down on tablet or papaya or something. Mentioning something like this to Ali next door wouldn't be out of the question. Anything literary that backs this bible claim?

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