Steven Carr

Greater love hath no man than he blames his friends for his death.

In 'The Passion of the Christ', Mel Gibson portrayed his own hands as driving in the nails, to symbolise how we are all guilty of the death of Christ.

Why did Jesus lay down his life for his friends, and then say that his friends were guilty of wickedly killing him?

Chili

Well Christ never died but Jesus did, as Jew, and he deserved to die as Jew and only as Jew in effort to set Christ free. I can see Mel Gibson's sentiment here (never saw the movie) and I can also imagine the resurrected Jesus laughing at the phariesees who were so are eager and willing to do Gods dirty work.

Gawen

Once again God uses proxy's to do his own "dirty work". The perfect God blames it on his pathetic human creation and then laughs at them for being less-than-Godly dupes.

KingLouie

Because they were?

I don't know man, I'm not much of a biblical scholar. But can we get a scripture quote of this, for reference, so we can see in black-and-white what a peckerwood Jesus Christ was?

From the Jungles of Scripture Quotin',

Kang Louie

Chili

But humans are not part of God's creation (God created "man" in his image) and humans will never find their way back to Eden without an inspired religion that has humans remove the human condition from each other.

Gawen

Has it ever occured to you that some humans don't want to find an Eden? That some humans don't believe in paradises? That the "human condition" is what it's supposed to be? After all, we are human, right? And to remove the human condition is to dehumanise humanity, making us puppets for an alleged higher cause and being?

No thanks. I can't be bothered. I have kids that I need to make sure find their way through this world, let alone worry about finding a mystical magical alledged paradise when they're dead.

Gawen

This is new. I've never heard this before.

Chili

But you don't have to and I will never preach to you nor urge that you should become either Catholic or Christian. In fact, I would advise against that for your and my sake.

It's good to be human and it's great to be human. It is nice to love and be loved and at least pretend to be in charge of your own destiny. I am a ferocius 'chest beater' myself, but it is not ours to chose for if "another will tie you fast and carry you off against your will" (Jn.21:18) there is not much you can do about, I would say.

Chili

God created man and our human condition became ours when we began to respond to our faculty of reason. It is called the Tree of Knowledge in Gen and our human condition was formed after man consumed from that tree which resides in our own mind . . . wherefore we have a dual identity and this is made very clear in the shame/no shame distinction that is made between Gen.2:25 and Gen.3:7. where they first "realized that they were naked."

I guess the upshot of this is that our second nature, or human condition, is ours but came to us later and is therefore outside of creation and not of God.

xxthe_leewitxx

Note: The off-topic portions of this discussion were split off to form this thread. Please refrain from any further derailments. Splitting threads hurts my brain.

Thank you,
the Leewit