Pouye

This is not from a website or a book. It is my own study material. It is also long and probably boring. If you get through it you have a better attention span than I do. Pick at it, and you might get some "answers" as far a Biblical perspective goes...

There are three Biblical phases to �heaven�:

Phase 1: Before Christ comes to reign on earth: �The Age of the Gentiles�

�And when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then you will know that the time of its destruction has arrived. Then those in Judea must flee to the hills. Let those in Jerusalem escape, and those outside the city should not enter it for shelter. For those will be days of God's vengeance, and the prophetic words of the Scriptures will be fulfilled. How terrible it will be for pregnant women and for mothers nursing their babies. For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. They will be brutally killed by the sword or sent away as captives to all the nations of the world. And Jerusalem will be conquered and trampled down by the Gentiles until the age of the Gentiles comes to an end.�
Luke 21:20-24

�I want you to understand this mystery, dear brothers and sisters, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Some of the Jews have hard hearts, but this will last only until the complete number of Gentiles comes to Christ. And so all Israel will be saved. Do you remember what the prophets said about this?

�A Deliverer will come from Jerusalem,
and he will turn Israel from all ungodliness.
And then I will keep my covenant with them
and take away their sins.�

�Many of the Jews are now enemies of the Good News. But this has been to your benefit, for God has given his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still his chosen people because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. For God's gifts and his call can never be withdrawn. Once, you Gentiles were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his mercy, God was merciful to you instead. And now, in the same way, the Jews are the rebels, and God's mercy has come to you. But someday they, too, will share in God's mercy.� Romans 11:25-31

Many prophecies in the Old Testament were fulfilled when Jerusalem was destroyed in AD 70 and when the Jews were scattered into the nations as a result. The age of the Gentiles hasn�t ended yet, because it will only end when Christ returns and rules from Jerusalem again (as �King of the Jews� and the world!) The very next verses in Luke 21:20-24 tell us what will happen when the Age of the Gentiles is about to end and Jerusalem (and all of Israel) is once again restored � this time with Christ as it�s King:

�And there will be strange events in the skies�signs in the sun, moon, and stars. And down here on earth the nations will be in turmoil, perplexed by the roaring seas and strange tides. The courage of many people will falter because of the fearful fate they see coming upon the earth, because the stability of the very heavens will be broken up. Then everyone will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds with power and great glory. So when all these things begin to happen, stand straight and look up, for your salvation is near!�
Luke 21:25-28

When the Age of the Gentiles is about to be finished and the time when Christ will return comes near, the above verses will begin their fulfillment (see Phase 2, in my next post).

Right now, for all practical purposes, �heaven� is actually what the Bible calls Paradise. Some argue that Paradise is not actually heaven, but very close to it, or moved into it. Whether heaven is close to Paradise or Paradise is a �part� of heaven or is just another term for heaven isn�t completely clear in the Scriptures. Paul describes the �third heaven� as �paradise�. Both heaven and Paradise are used to describe where the souls of those who God has chosen to be with Him go and await the time when the rest of the world will be judged.
The souls waiting in Paradise will rise again in the first resurrection of the dead and reign with Christ. The rest of the dead will not come to life until after the thousand years reign of Christ and the Great White Throne judgment takes place.
(See also Revelation 6:9)

�I was caught up into the third heaven fourteen years ago. Whether my body was there or just my spirit, I don't know; only God knows. But I do know that I was caught up into paradise and heard things so astounding that they cannot be told.� 2 Corinthians 12:2,3

Paradise is where Jesus said the thief on the cross crucified next to Him would go. Jesus said that He would be there, too. We know other believers (including all of the saints of old) will be there to comfort all those who realize their need for God and put their hope and trust in Christ. (See Luke 23:40-43; Luke 16:22-23)

Paradise is where the SOUL goes. This is important! The soul will not be reunited with a new, resurrected body until later � when Christ returns to reign on the earth for a thousand years:

�But there is an order to this resurrection: Christ was raised first; then when Christ comes back, all his people will be raised.� Romans 15:23

�Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. For them the second death holds no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him a thousand years.� Revelation 20:6-

�And so I solemnly urge you before God and before Christ Jesus�who will someday judge the living and the dead when he appears to set up his Kingdom: Preach the word of God. Be persistent, whether the time is favorable or not. Patiently correct, rebuke, and encourage your people with good teaching.�
2 Timothy 4:1-2

So when we die, our soul goes to be with Jesus in Paradise and we wait for Christ to return to subdue (judge) the nations of the earth and reign from Jerusalem as King for a thousand years with all those who believe(d) in Him:

�Then I saw thrones, and the people sitting on them had been given the authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony about Jesus, for proclaiming the word of God. And I saw the souls of those who had not worshiped the beast or his statue, nor accepted his mark on their forehead or their hands. They came to life again, and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years. This is the first resurrection. (The rest of the dead did not come back to life until the thousand years had ended.) Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. For them the second death holds no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him a thousand years.� Revelation 20:4-6

�Then the LORD will go out to fight against those nations [which tried to destroy Israel], as he has fought in times past. On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which faces Jerusalem on the east. And the Mount of Olives will split apart, making a wide valley running from east to west, for half the mountain will move toward the north and half toward the south. You will flee through this valley, for it will reach across to Azal. Yes, you will flee as you did from the earthquake in the days of King Uzziah of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all his holy ones with him.�
Zechariah 14:3-5

�Messenger of good news, shout to Zion from the mountaintops! Shout louder to Jerusalem�do not be afraid. Tell the towns of Judah, �Your God is coming!� Yes, the Sovereign LORD is coming in all his glorious power. He will rule with awesome strength. See, he brings his reward with him as he comes. He will feed his flock like a shepherd. He will carry the lambs in his arms, holding them close to his heart. He will gently lead the mother sheep with their young.� Isaiah 40:9-11

Notice the �trumpets� in the next verses:

�And then at last, the sign of the coming of the Son of Man will appear in the heavens, and there will be deep mourning among all the nations of the earth. And they will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send forth his angels with the sound of a mighty trumpet blast, and they will gather together his chosen ones from the farthest ends of the earth and heaven.� Matthew 24:30-

�Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices shouting in heaven: �The whole world has now become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever.�� Revelation 11:15

�But let me tell you a wonderful secret God has revealed to us. Not all of us will die, but we will all be transformed. It will happen in a moment, in the blinking of an eye, when the last trumpet is blown. For when the trumpet sounds, the Christians who have died will be raised with transformed bodies. And then we who are living will be transformed so that we will never die. For our perishable earthly bodies must be transformed into heavenly bodies that will never die.� 1 Corinthians 15:51-

Phase 2 is the next post

Rock

Pouye

Phase 2: The First Judgment of the Nations, the Millennial Battle and The Thousand Year Reign of Christ on Earth:

There is no question the Millennial Reign of Christ is yet to happen. There are some Christians (and Christian-based cults) who believe we are now in the thousand year reign, but this is biblically impossible since we are not yet in our new, resurrected bodies! Not only that, but Satan will be bound during the thousand year reign, and he seems to be very active today. Besides Jerusalem being the most important city on earth, there are some other things which will be happening during the thousand year reign of Christ:

�On that day the sources of light will no longer shine, yet there will be continuous day! Only the LORD knows how this could happen! There will be no normal day and night, for at evening time it will still be light. On that day life-giving waters will flow out from Jerusalem, half toward the Dead Sea and half toward the Mediterranean, flowing continuously both in summer and in winter. And the LORD will be king over all the earth. On that day there will be one LORD�his name alone will be worshiped. All the land from Geba, north of Judah, to Rimmon, south of Jerusalem, will become one vast plain. But Jerusalem will be raised up in its original place and will be inhabited all the way from the Benjamin Gate over to the site of the old gate, then to the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the king's winepresses. And Jerusalem will be filled, safe at last, never again to be cursed and destroyed.� Zechariah 14:6-11

"Then the LORD will bless you with rain at planting time. There will be wonderful harvests and plenty of pastureland for your cattle. The oxen and donkeys that till the ground will eat good grain, its chaff having been blown away by the wind. In that day, when your enemies are slaughtered, there will be streams of water flowing down every mountain and hill. The moon will be as bright as the sun, and the sun will be seven times brighter�like the light of seven days! So it will be when the LORD begins to heal his people and cure the wounds he gave them." Isaiah 30:23-

�The time will come,� says the LORD, �when the grain and grapes will grow faster than they can be harvested. Then the terraced vineyards on the hills of Israel will drip with sweet wine! I will bring my exiled people of Israel back from distant lands, and they will rebuild their ruined cities and live in them again. They will plant vineyards and gardens; they will eat their crops and drink their wine. I will firmly plant them there in the land I have given them,� says the LORD your God. �Then they will never be uprooted again.�
Amos 9:13-15

Notice the rivers flowing from Jerusalem in the above verses. At least one of these two rivers will flow directly from the Throne of God (called the River of Life):

�And the angel showed me a pure river with the water of life, clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb, coursing down the center of the main street. On each side of the river grew a tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, with a fresh crop each month. The leaves were used for medicine to heal the nations.� Revelation 22:1-2
(Note: I realize that the above situation is actually mentioned AFTER the thousand year reign of Christ, but it still applies because the river and the events above begin at the coming of Christ and these waters will continue to flow forever � well after the thousand year reign ends.)

Here we see Ezekiel visited by a heavenly being describing the above verses in Revelation 22:1-2 in detail to him:

�Then the man brought me back to the entrance of the Temple. There I saw a stream flowing eastward from beneath the Temple threshold. This stream then passed to the right of the altar on its south side. The man brought me outside the wall through the north gateway and led me around to the eastern entrance. There I could see the stream flowing out through the south side of the east gateway...
...Suddenly, to my surprise, many trees were now growing on both sides of the river! Then he said to me, �This river flows east through the desert into the Jordan Valley, where it enters the Dead Sea. The waters of this stream will heal the salty waters of the Dead Sea and make them fresh and pure. Everything that touches the water of this river will live. Fish will abound in the Dead Sea, for its waters will be healed. Wherever this water flows, everything will live. Fishermen will stand along the shores of the Dead Sea, fishing all the way from En-gedi to En-eglaim. The shores will be covered with nets drying in the sun. Fish of every kind will fill the Dead Sea, just as they fill the Mediterranean. But the marshes and swamps will not be purified; they will be sources of salt. All kinds of fruit trees will grow along both sides of the river. The leaves of these trees will never turn brown and fall, and there will always be fruit on their branches. There will be a new crop every month, without fail! For they are watered by the river flowing from the Temple. The fruit will be for food and the leaves for healing.�
Ezekiel 47: 1-11

�In the last days, the Temple of the LORD in Jerusalem will become the most important place on earth.� Isaiah 2:2a

Phase 2, Part 2 is coming...

Pouye

Sub point -- Israel and the Church:

Right now, Israel is not living in safety. Not only that, but the Dead Sea is still dead � so full of salt that it cannot sustain fish of any kind. It is interesting to note that the Dead Sea is the lowest point on earth. It is a salt lake, about 397 m (1,300 ft) below sea level, between Israel and Jordan. The Jordan Valley will be transformed during the Millennial Reign of Christ when the River of Life fills much of it up.

There are some Christians who believe that present day people we call Jews in Israel are not the same Jews, nor the same Israel which will be restored. But I believe the Jews of Israel we see today are a �remnant� which has been brought back from many nations to show God�s power. (see Amos 9:13-15) Hebrew is the national language of Israel today. Anyone who knows anything about language and culture can tell you that they are inseparable. If the people in Israel who call themselves Jews today did not speak Hebrew, I might be convinced that they are not truly God�s chosen people, the Jews. But since the majority of Jews speak Hebrew in Israel, I am completely convinced that this �stubborn remnant� has been miraculously brought back to their homeland once again. Here is what will happen to the remnant we see today: They will be attacked (possibly over a period of time, like we see now in the news every day) and then they will be eventually attacked full out from all sides. As they see themselves losing this battle (they will be partially destroyed) they will cry out to God (read the short book of Joel, which describes this entire scene from start to finish).
God will let them feel some distress (a partial testing time) and let them realize that they are not strong enough in their own might to defeat the nations around them:

�Watch, for the day of the LORD is coming when your possessions will be plundered right in front of you! On that day I will gather all the nations to fight against Jerusalem. The city will be taken, the houses plundered, and the women raped. Half the population will be taken away into captivity, and half will be left among the ruins of the city.
Then the LORD will go out to fight against those nations, as he has fought in times past. On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which faces Jerusalem on the east. And the Mount of Olives will split apart, making a wide valley running from east to west, for half the mountain will move toward the north and half toward the south. You will flee through this valley, for it will reach across to Azal. Yes, you will flee as you did from the earthquake in the days of King Uzziah of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all his holy ones with him.� Zechariah 14:1-5

Notice in the above that Jerusalem is once again the center of world attention, and these verses speak specifically to Israel as a nation. Today Jerusalem is again the center of focus for the rest of the world, and Israel is once again a nation after 2000 years. Israel is once again in turmoil, yet many Jews are not relying on the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob to rescue them from their troubles. If today�s Israel is not the Israel which is attacked, then it must be a future nation of Israel after the one which became a nation in 1948. Why look for another Israel? The Israel of today is in just the right position for all these things to be fulfilled.

Following this battle there will be the gathering of all the rest of God�s people (the Jews) and all the Gentile believers who make up the Body of Christ:

�In that day the heir to David's throne will be a banner of salvation to all the world. The nations will rally to him, for the land where he lives will be a glorious place. In that day the Lord will bring back a remnant of his people for the second time, returning them to the land of Israel from Assyria, Lower Egypt, Upper Egypt, Ethiopia, Elam, Babylonia, Hamath, and all the distant coastlands. He will raise a flag among the nations for Israel to rally around. He will gather the scattered people of Judah from the ends of the earth.� Isaiah 11:10-13a



�Look! He comes with the clouds of heaven. And everyone will see him�even those who pierced him [the Jews]. And all the nations of the earth will weep because of him. �Yes! Amen! I am the Alpha and the Omega�the beginning and the end,� says the Lord God. �I am the one who is, who always was, and who is still to come, the Almighty One.��
Revelation 1:7,8

�I can tell you this directly from the Lord: We who are still living when the Lord returns will not rise to meet him ahead of those who are in their graves. For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the call of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, all the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and remain with him forever.�
1 Thessalonians 4:15-
(Note: We will not rise to meet the Lord in the air and then STAY in the air... we will be meeting Jesus in the air and then coming DOWN TO EARTH again to reign with Him. Many Christians believe we will �fly away� to some otherworldly place in the clouds when Christ returns, which is false!):

�They came to life again, and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years.�
Revelation 20:4b

�God blesses those who are gentle and lowly,
for the whole earth will belong to them.� Matthew 5:5

�As my vision continued that night, I saw someone who looked like a man [Aramaic reads: �like a son of man�] coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient One and was led into his presence. He was given authority, honor, and royal power over all the nations of the world, so that people of every race and nation and language would obey him. His rule is eternal�it will never end. His kingdom will never be destroyed.�
Daniel 7:13-14

Just prior to the Millennial Battle, Christ allows �hard-hearted�Israel to see their need for a Messiah by letting the nations attack them. When they begin to loose the battle and feel all hope is lost, they will call on God. Then Christ will come and judge the nations who attacked Israel and show Israel that He was (and is) truly their Messiah. The Millennial Battle (sometimes referred to as Armageddon) is different than the Last Battle which is fought when Satan is released after the Thousand Year Reign of Christ (Battle of Gog and Magog).

In the fist Battle, most of Israel will fall under the surrounding armies, and at least half of Jerusalem will be captured. It will be a desperate time for the Jews, who will finally cry out to God for help. The Millennial Battle is Christ�s return as Israel�s Messiah and Savior, this time coming to turn them to Him and then fight for them! The whole earth is NOT destroyed by fire at this time, but about a third of it is. The Great Tribulation will be the 7 year period when all this judgment takes place and the Kingdom of God, with Christ as King, will begin ruling the earth.

Much of the earth will be destroyed by all of the judgments poured out on it, but there will be survivors from many nations. (See Phase 3 for a description of the last and Final Battle)


What will Phase 2 (Christ�s thousand year reign on earth) be like?

No Satan!

�Then I saw an angel come down from heaven with the key to the bottomless pit and a heavy chain in his hand. He seized the dragon�that old serpent, the Devil, Satan�and bound him in chains for a thousand years. The angel threw him into the bottomless pit, which he then shut and locked so Satan could not deceive the nations anymore until the thousand years were finished. Afterward he would be released again for a little while.�
Revelation 20:1-3

�In that day the LORD will punish the fallen angels in the heavens and the proud rulers of the nations on earth. They will be rounded up and put in prison until they are tried and condemned.� Isaiah 24:21-22 (This verse refers to the �put in prison� part of Rev. 20)

There will still be nations, and Jesus will grant His children (both Jew and Gentile) the authority to judge (settle problems, etc.) and rule over those nations:

�If we endure hardship,
we will reign with him.� 1 Timothy 2:12

�Then I saw thrones, and the people sitting on them had been given the authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony about Jesus, for proclaiming the word of God. And I saw the souls of those who had not worshiped the beast or his statue, nor accepted his mark on their forehead or their hands. They came to life again, and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years.�
Revelation 20:4

�But in the end, the holy people of the Most High will be given the kingdom, and they will rule forever and ever.� Daniel 7:18

Then the sovereignty, power, and greatness of all the kingdoms under heaven will be given to the holy people of the Most High. They will rule forever, and all rulers will serve and obey them.� Daniel 7:27



�The nations will see your righteousness. Kings will be blinded by your glory. And the LORD will give you a new name. The LORD will hold you in his hands for all to see�a splendid crown in the hands of God. Never again will you be called the Godforsaken City or the Desolate Land. Your new name will be the City of God's Delight and the Bride of God, for the LORD delights in you and will claim you as his own.�
Isaiah 62:2-4


�The whole earth will acknowledge the LORD and return to him.
People from every nation will bow down before him.
For the LORD is king!
He rules all the nations.� Psalms 22:27-28

Here is what happens if any nation does not honor Jesus and His children during the thousand year reign:

�In the end, the enemies of Jerusalem who survive the plague [which God sent on all the nations which attacked Israel] will go up to Jerusalem each year to worship the King, the LORD Almighty, and to celebrate the Festival of Shelters. And any nation anywhere in the world that refuses to come to Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD Almighty, will have no rain.� Zechariah 14:16-18

There will be babies, children and families:

�No longer will babies die when only a few days old. No longer will adults die before they have lived a full life. No longer will people be considered old at one hundred! Only sinners will die that young! In those days, people will live in the houses they build and eat the fruit of their own vineyards. It will not be like the past, when invaders took the houses and confiscated the vineyards. For my people will live as long as trees and will have time to enjoy their hard-won gains. They will not work in vain, and their children will not be doomed to misfortune. For they are people blessed by the LORD, and their children, too, will be blessed.� Isaiah 65:20-25

There will be animals. The animals which are on �God�s Holy Mountain� or Zion will be changed. They will no longer harm humans or livestock. The omnivorous creatures will loose their carnivorous instincts and will only eat plant matter:

�At that time I will make a covenant with all the wild animals and the birds and the animals that scurry along the ground so that they will not harm you.� Hosea 2:18

�In that day the wolf and the lamb will live together; the leopard and the goat will be at peace. Calves and yearlings will be safe among lions, and a little child will lead them all. The cattle will graze among bears. Cubs and calves will lie down together. And lions will eat grass as the livestock do. Babies will crawl safely among poisonous snakes. Yes, a little child will put its hand in a nest of deadly snakes and pull it out unharmed. Nothing will hurt or destroy in all my holy mountain. And as the waters fill the sea, so the earth will be filled with people who know the LORD.� In that day the heir to David's throne will be a banner of salvation to all the world. The nations will rally to him, for the land where he lives will be a glorious place.� Isaiah 11:6-10



It very much appears to me that the earth during the thousand year reign of Christ will be inhabited during the thousand year reign by �fallen� people just like we have now on earth. The earth will prosper under the reign of Christ and His Holy Ones (that is us!), and since Satan will be bound up, the nations will enjoy peace and prosperity. These fallen people will actually be getting saved (coming to Christ and being born again) after the return of Christ as these verses indicate:

�In the last days, the Temple of the LORD in Jerusalem will become the most important place on earth. People from all over the world will go there to worship. Many nations will come and say, �Come, let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the Temple of the God of Israel. There he will teach us his ways, so that we may obey him.� For in those days the LORD's teaching and his word will go out from Jerusalem. The LORD will settle international disputes. All the nations will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. All wars will stop, and military training will come to an end.�
Isaiah 2:1-4 (see Micah 4:1-4 which is almost verbatim)

�In that day the heir to David's throne [Jesus] will be a banner of salvation to all the world. The nations will rally to him, for the land where he lives will be a glorious place.�
Isaiah 11:10

There will be two kinds of human beings on earth:

There are all those who have been transformed in the first resurrection (both dead and alive, Jew and Gentile) and those who are on earth who survived the tribulation period. This includes all of the believers in Christ and the saints of the Old Testament who have died since the creation of the world until Christ returns � including those believers who survive the Great Tribulation to see Jesus return. This group is described as those of the first resurrection. They are all those who have been born again and redeemed from every nation.

Those who survive the Great Tribulation will merely have fallen, perishable bodies like we have today (since they were not born again). During the thousand year reign, many of these people will �wash their robes� (a euphemism for believing in Christ becoming born again) and enter the gates of Jerusalem to eat from the tree of life which will give them eternal life, and they will wait for the second resurrection to be judged along with everyone else, most likely getting their resurrected bodies then (but God only knows...).

�Arise, Jerusalem! Let your light shine for all the nations to see! For the glory of the LORD is shining upon you. Darkness as black as night will cover all the nations of the earth, but the glory of the LORD will shine over you. All nations will come to your light. Mighty kings will come to see your radiance.� Isaiah 60:1-3

�And now the LORD speaks�he who formed me in my mother's womb to be his servant, who commissioned me to bring his people of Israel back to him. The LORD has honored me, and my God has given me strength. He says, �You will do more than restore the people of Israel to me. I will make you a light to the Gentiles, and you will bring my salvation to the ends of the earth.� Isaiah 49:5,6

�How beautiful on the mountains are the feet of those who bring good news of peace and salvation, the news that the God of Israel reigns! The watchmen shout and sing with joy, for before their very eyes they see the LORD bringing his people home to Jerusalem. Let the ruins of Jerusalem break into joyful song, for the LORD has comforted his people. He has redeemed Jerusalem. The LORD will demonstrate his holy power before the eyes of all the nations. The ends of the earth will see the salvation of our God.� Isaiah 52:7-10

�And so the LORD's fame will be celebrated in Zion, His praises in Jerusalem, when the multitudes gather together and kingdoms come to worship the LORD.�
Psalms 102: 21,22

�And the LORD will send a plague on all the nations that fought against Jerusalem...
...The wealth of all the neighboring nations will be captured�great quantities of gold and silver and fine clothing. This same plague will strike the horses, mules, camels, donkeys, and all the other animals in the enemy camps. In the end, the enemies of Jerusalem who survive the plague will go up to Jerusalem each year to worship the King, the LORD Almighty, and to celebrate the Festival of Shelters.� Zechariah 14:12-16

Many Jews who finally recognize their Messiah when Jesus saves them from the surrounding armies who attacked them will finally believe Jesus is truly their Messiah and they will be saved and ushered into the New Covenant (get saved) when Christ returns:

�Did God's people stumble and fall beyond recovery? Of course not! His purpose was to make his salvation available to the Gentiles, and then the Jews would be jealous and want it for themselves. Now if the Gentiles were enriched because the Jews turned down God's offer of salvation, think how much greater a blessing the world will share when the Jews finally accept it.� Romans 11:11,12

�I want you to understand this mystery, dear brothers and sisters, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Some of the Jews have hard hearts, but this will last only until the complete number of Gentiles comes to Christ. And so all Israel will be saved. Do you remember what the prophets said about this?
�A Deliverer will come from Jerusalem,
and he will turn Israel from all ungodliness.
And then I will keep my covenant with them
and take away their sins.�� [Isaiah 59:20-21]
Many of the Jews are now enemies of the Good News. But this has been to your benefit, for God has given his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still his chosen people because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. For God's gifts and his call can never be withdrawn. Once, you Gentiles were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his mercy, God was merciful to you instead. And now, in the same way, the Jews are the rebels, and God's mercy has come to you. But someday they, too, will share in God's mercy.� Romans 11:25-31

�No, you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to thousands of angels in joyful assembly. You have come to the assembly of God's firstborn children, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God himself, who is the judge of all people. And you have come to the spirits of the redeemed in heaven who have now been made perfect. You have come to Jesus, the one who mediates the new covenant between God and people, and to the sprinkled blood, which graciously forgives instead of crying out for vengeance as the blood of Abel did.�
Hebrews 12:22-24

Pouye

Phase 3: The New Heavens, The New Earth, , The New Jerusalem, the Last Battle (Gog and Magog�s destruction), the final Judgment of all, and Jesus turns the Kingdom over to His Father:

There are several places in the Bible where the New Heaven and the New earth are mentioned. Here are some of the verses:

�But the day of the Lord will come as unexpectedly as a thief. Then the heavens will pass away with a terrible noise, and everything in them will disappear in fire, and the earth and everything on it will be exposed to judgment. Since everything around us is going to melt away, what holy, godly lives you should be living! You should look forward to that day and hurry it along�the day when God will set the heavens on fire and the elements will melt away in the flames. But we are looking forward to the new heavens and new earth he has promised, a world where everyone is right with God.�
2 Peter 3:10,11

The above verses corresponds to this verse just before it:

�They deliberately forget that God made the heavens by the word of his command, and he brought the earth up from the water and surrounded it with water. Then he used the water to destroy the world with a mighty flood. And God has also commanded that the heavens and the earth will be consumed by fire on the day of judgment, when ungodly people will perish.� 2 Peter 3:5-7





These verses are talking specifically about the new heavens and new earth, which fits perfectly with all the other verses about the new heavens and new earth which are ushered in after the thousand year reign of Christ. There will be a final Battle when Satan is let out to deceive the nations one last time. This nations who fight against God in this Last Battle are always referred to in Scripture as Gog and Magog:

�Get ready [Gog and Magog]; be prepared! Keep all the armies around you mobilized, and take command of them. A long time from now you will be called into action. In the distant future you will swoop down on the land of Israel, which will be lying in peace after her recovery from war and after the return of her people from many lands. You and all your allies�a vast and awesome horde�will roll down on them like a storm and cover the land like a cloud.� Ezekiel 38:7-9

(Notice how God tells us these things will happen in �the distant future� after Israel is at peace and has returned from many lands.)

�This is what the Sovereign LORD says: You are the one I was talking about long ago, when I announced through Israel's prophets that in future days I would bring you against my people. But when Gog invades the land of Israel, says the Sovereign LORD, my fury will rise! For in my jealousy and blazing anger, I promise a mighty shaking in the land of Israel on that day. All living things�all the fish, birds, animals, and people�will quake in terror at my presence. Mountains will be thrown down; cliffs will crumble; walls will fall to the earth. I will summon the sword against you throughout Israel, says the Sovereign LORD. Your men will turn against each other in mortal combat. I will punish you and your hordes with disease and bloodshed; I will send torrential rain, hailstones, fire, and burning sulfur! Thus will I show my greatness and holiness, and I will make myself known to all the nations of the world. Then they will know that I am the LORD!�
Ezekiel 38:17-23

The above verses correspond with the only other place Gog and Magog are mentioned in the Bible:

�When the thousand years end, Satan will be let out of his prison. He will go out to deceive the nations from every corner of the earth, which are called Gog and Magog. He will gather them together for battle�a mighty host, as numberless as sand along the shore. And I saw them as they went up on the broad plain of the earth and surrounded God's people and the beloved city. But fire from heaven came down on the attacking armies and consumed them.� Revelation 20:7

This Last Battle ushers in the New Heavens and New Earth. Unlike the Millennial Battle, in the Last Battle Israel will not be partially captured by it�s enemies. The Final Battle will be a landslide victory � a completely one-sided wipe out! It will be Satan�s final attempt to destroy as many people as possible and take as many with him to his final destruction.

�Look! I am creating new heavens and a new earth�so wonderful that no one will even think about the old ones anymore. Be glad; rejoice forever in my creation! And look! I will create Jerusalem as a place of happiness. Her people will be a source of joy. I will rejoice in Jerusalem and delight in my people. And the sound of weeping and crying will be heard no more.� Isaiah 65:17-19

At the end of the thousand year reign of Christ, Christ does something very interesting... He gives the Kingdom over to His Father, who destroy the old earth and heavens (by fire) and recreates the earth and the heavens and makes His new home among His people!

�But there is an order to this resurrection: Christ was raised first; then when Christ comes back, all his people will be raised After that [the millennial reign] the end will come, when he will turn the Kingdom over to God the Father, having put down all enemies of every kind. For Christ must reign until he humbles all his enemies beneath his feet. And the last enemy to be destroyed is death [death is destroyed at the end of the thousand year reign]. For the Scriptures say, �God has given him authority over all things.� (Of course, when it says �authority over all things,� it does not include God himself, who gave Christ his authority.) Then, when he has conquered all things, the Son will present himself to God, so that God, who gave his Son authority over all things, will be utterly supreme over everything everywhere.�
1 Corinthians 15:23-28 (inserts and emphasis mine)

After the millennial reign...

�Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the old heaven and the old earth had disappeared. And the sea was also gone. And I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven like a beautiful bride prepared for her husband. I heard a loud shout from the throne, saying, �Look, the home of God is now among his people! He will live with them, and they will be his people. God himself will be with them. He will remove all of their sorrows, and there will be no more death or sorrow or crying or pain. For the old world and its evils are gone forever.� Revelation 21:1-4

�No temple could be seen in the city, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. And the city has no need of sun or moon, for the glory of God illuminates the city, and the Lamb is its light. The nations of the earth will walk in its light, and the rulers of the world will come and bring their glory to it. Its gates never close at the end of day because there is no night. And all the nations will bring their glory and honor into the city. Nothing evil will be allowed to enter�no one who practices shameful idolatry and dishonesty�but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life.�

It is interesting to note that even after the new heavens and new earth there are �the nations� and �rulers of the world� coming to New Jerusalem. These nations are most likely ruled by God�s children in their immortal bodies, serving as judges, kings, queens, and priests. The new earth and everything it will be glorious! There will be no more sin, sorrow, or pain. Earth will finally be fully restored (re-created).

The last verses of Revelation go back to talking about the Second Coming of Christ:

�See, I am coming soon, and my reward is with me, to repay all according to their deeds. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.�
Revelation 22:12

That is why the following verse seems very confusing after the whole discourse about the new heavens and new earth, but does not fit with the new heaven and new earth (where sin will be no more):

�Blessed are those who wash their robes so they can enter through the gates of the city and eat the fruit from the tree of life. Outside the city are the dogs�the sorcerers, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idol worshipers, and all who love to live a lie.� Revelation 22:14

This above verse clearly refers to the millennial reign after the Second Coming (which is in context) and the �old earth� which Christ and all of His children will rule over for a thousand years. There will still be sin in the old earth, but Satan will be bound so that many people will repent and rally to Jerulsalem (to Christ) to be saved. But during the thousand year reign, many people will not be saved. The free will of people will still exist, and many of them will be deceived when Satan is finally let out of his thousand year pit.

However, the New Heaven and New Earth will be sinless:

�Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the old heaven and the old earth had disappeared. And the sea was also gone. And I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven like a beautiful bride prepared for her husband. I heard a loud shout from the throne, saying, �Look, the home of God is now among his people! He will live with them, and they will be his people. God himself will be with them. He will remove all of their sorrows, and there will be no more death or sorrow or crying or pain. For the old world and its evils are gone forever.� Revelation 21:1-4

�For all creation is waiting eagerly for that future day when God will reveal who his children really are. Against its will, everything on earth was subjected to God's curse. All creation anticipates the day when it will join God's children in glorious freedom from death and decay. For we know that all creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time.� Romans 8:19-21

The End!

ps. Aren't you glad?!

Rock

calladus

hardware or software?

Speaking hardware wise, with genetics and physics, we are pretty darn close. Or else why would Christian Fundies be so scared of human cloning?

Speaking software (wetware?) wise, from my readings of psychology, scientists have been applying the physical to psychology with pretty good results.

And as for 2000 years of "Intensive" research? Yea, right. There has been some good science in the past, but it was usually violently suppressed by true believers. Only fairly recently have people managed to keep the Church from killing people as heritics for proving that the Earth is round.

Amos

. . . that was a long story! I did not read it but must say that you believe a lot!

I'll direct my response to the OP and say that when people physically die they will soon get buried. This is true for all people and I think what you are looking for is if there is such a thing as a soul that can survive death.

From my previous post you may remember that our soul is that part of us that we do not know and also that when we know ourselves there is no soul left: "Then I saw the new heavens and the new earth. [My] former [idea of] the heavens and the former earth had passed away, the [celestial] sea was no longer (Rev.211).

I should now add that we 'look' with our eyes but 'see' with our mind to say that when we "see" the new heavens and the new earth, our soul ("the sea" here), will be no longer because we will see with the fullness of our mind (subconscious mind become concious to us).

Simple isn't it? It just means that when we know ourselves our soul will be no longer and therefore is our soul that part of our own mind that we do not know. Therefore also, the new heaven and the new earth is the same old heaven and earth now seen in the fullness of understanding (kowledge frees).

Question is: how can our soul survive death?

It can only survive our first death if we die to our ego identity when we are forced to give an account of ourselves (see my post on "age of accountability"). After our first death we will be one with our soul and without a soul it can therefore no longer die (no soul = no death possible).

The only way the soul can die is when we fail to remove the unknown part of our existence during the grand inquisition with regard to who we really are. It is called the grand inquisition because it is the time of our first death . . . which must be a fact for there to be a testament (Hebrews 9:15) wherein we inherit the NT covenant of eternal inheritance. For the rest, including those who do not encounter a grand inquisition in their life: there in no love lost when our soul dies because if our soul is that part of us that we did not know how can we miss it when we die? Therefore "cold" is OK and the bible is right after all! (snicker snicker).

Eternal inheritance is ours because the Thousand Year Reign is contained within our soul wherefore our inheritance is eternal life instead of death (eternal and therefore timeless because time-as-such is not known in our subconscious mind now become conscious yet still timeless).

Pouye if you dare post this one at your camp they'll either deny it or all go home.

Edited to add that you may have noticed that "eternal life" ends when the "Thousand Year Reign" ends which is when we die our second death and get buried like the all others. Eternal is opposite to temporal and must be known to exist to make temporal known . . . otherwise we could have no knowledge thereoff.

Amos

Yeah right, and just after that intensive research of the recent past we must wonder why fertility clinics outnumber abortion clinics. I'd say that if your world was so well rounded you should be concerned why modern people are so eager to kill their own offspring if they can't hardly reproduce anymore. Is that good science to you?

Nate Jones

What happens to Christians after they die?

I believe that we go to Paradise until Christ comes again. Thus, at the end of the world, all Christians will go to Heaven from Paradise.

This is a common protestant Christian belief.

Mageth

What happens to Christians after they die?
Six feet under, and their loved ones cry.
After that, they become worm pie,
'Til nothing's left where their bones do lie.

Pouye

"But tell me this�since we preach that Christ rose from the dead, why are some of you saying there will be no resurrection of the dead? For if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised either. And if Christ was not raised, then all our preaching is useless, and your trust in God is useless. And we apostles would all be lying about God, for we have said that God raised Christ from the grave, but that can't be true if there is no resurrection of the dead. If there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised. And if Christ has not been raised, then your faith is useless, and you are still under condemnation for your sins. In that case, all who have died believing in Christ have perished! And if we have hope in Christ only for this life, we are the most miserable people in the world.
But the fact is that Christ has been raised from the dead. He has become the first of a great harvest of those who will be raised to life again."
1 Corinthians 15:12-20

I like this ending better.

Rock