Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Constant Mews · 10-02-2007, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by Constant Mews

.... I am engaged in a discussion right now with a colleague about where this might fall on the Autism Spectrum.

....

Please do not insult those on the Autistim-Asperger's spectrum.

I'm not quite sure how to take that. If I have offended anyone, I apologize. :huh:

Toto · 10-02-2007, 10:18 AM

It was a bit sarcastic, but I don't think that Christians who witness are autistic. I think that the act of witnessing may look anti-social to those being witnesses to, but there is a lot more to autism.

ericmurphy · 10-02-2007, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seven Popes

Learn to google. Stupidity can be expensive.

As most of the scholarly work rests in books though and much of the material on internet highly suspect, isn't googling a formula for remaining stupid?

It was the internet that got him into this trouble, for where else did he find this outdated colophon crap. He didn't suddenly get an illumination from god to say that he had to read Air Commodore P.J. Wiseman's work -- which hasn't been in scholarly literature in the past 50 years.
spin

Getting his information from the Internet is not Dave's problem per se. It's possible to get valid information from the Internet if you are capable of making credibility assessments.

Dave is not.

And it's not just that he's getting his information from the Internet. It's that he's getting it from sites like AiG and ICR, which are jokes. But they're jokes that Dave agrees with. That's why he ends up citing texts from the 19th century all the time.

ericmurphy · 10-02-2007, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by afdave

CHAMPOLLION'S BIG MISTAKE PROVIDES KEY TO 'MISSING' ISRAELITE ACTIVITIES
Dean made a post recently providing supposed evidence against the Mosaic authorship of the Penateuch. http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.p...05#post4823205 His most important point was

Quote:

Evidence that Moses did not write the majority of the Torah

(Note: The biggest piece of evidence that Moses did not write the Torah is the archaeological evidence that there was no Exodus or Conquest, and therefore that it is incredibly unlikely that Moses ever existed. However, for the sake of argument, I am assuming in this thread that Moses did exist, and therefore my evidence and arguments here do not presuppose that he was merely a legendary figure.)

I will deal with Dean's other points later, but I want to address his most important point first.

How can you say something this stupid, Dave? Look at that bolded part, because obviously you missed it the first time round.

Constant Mews · 10-02-2007, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

It was a bit sarcastic, but I don't think that Christians who witness are autistic. I think that the act of witnessing may look anti-social to those being witnesses to, but there is a lot more to autism.

Of course. I apologize if that was the meaning you took from it.

There are characteristics, however, of the Witnessing behavior which involve the failure to 'read' reactions. I find these the most interesting part of the Witnessing problem.

-Jay- · 10-02-2007, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucretius

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinJay

Here's the contact information for the original publishers:

Thomas Nelson, Inc.
PO Box 141000
Nashville, TN 37214

They could probably tell you who currently owns the rights and whether they have any plans for a re-issue.

regards,

NinJay

As Donald J Wiseman is still alive and living in Australia, I would imagine that as he edited his late fathers work he would have some sort of copyright to the 1985 version at least.

Perhaps Dave would like one of us to look up Wiseman's address.

Here's a place to start...

Does anyone know if Wiseman maintains an active interest in the Tablet Theory? The only references that I can find to the original book with a very quick google search are from YEC pages, and a quick JSTOR search failed to turn up any journal cites of it.

regards,

NinJay

Constant Mews · 10-02-2007, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinJay

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucretius

As Donald J Wiseman is still alive and living in Australia, I would imagine that as he edited his late fathers work he would have some sort of copyright to the 1985 version at least.

Perhaps Dave would like one of us to look up Wiseman's address.

Here's a place to start...

Now, now. You're not implying that Dave might have trouble using the internet to find an address, are you?

Quote:

Does anyone know if Wiseman maintains an active interest in the Tablet Theory? The only references that I can find to the original book with a very quick google search are from YEC pages, and a quick JSTOR search failed to turn up any journal cites of it.

regards,

NinJay

As indicated, it's not considered viable and dropped without a ripple.

ericmurphy · 10-02-2007, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by afdave

Why does this matter? It matters because now, with Rohl's New Chronology, the Biblical accounts of the Israelites are confirmed as historical by the findings of archaeology. The Bible is a real history book which relates real activities of real people. It is not a "Bronze Age myth" as skeptics like to say. In fact, it is the most accurate history book in the world ... which makes sense that it would be if it truly is the Message of the Creator to Mankind.

Not even close, Dave. Real history books, which talk about real history, do not state as fact events, such as the creation myth and the flood myth, which cannot possibly be true. Both the creation myth and the flood myth are known to be myths, because for either one to be true would require multiple gross violations of natural law.

Whether the Bible is accurate in relating this or that historical event does not counterbalance the vastly inaccurate account it gives of both creation and the "flood," both of which are entirely fictional.

-Jay- · 10-02-2007, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Constant Mews

Now, now. You're not implying that Dave might have trouble using the internet to find an address, are you?

Who? Me? :devil:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Constant Mews

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinJay

]Does anyone know if Wiseman maintains an active interest in the Tablet Theory? The only references that I can find to the original book with a very quick google search are from YEC pages, and a quick JSTOR search failed to turn up any journal cites of it.

As indicated, it's not considered viable and dropped without a ripple.

That's about what I thought - it's obvious it isn't a contender to knock off the DH, but I wasn't sure if it had more traction within the YEC community than it appeared to in my quick check. Thanks.

regards,

NinJay

ericmurphy · 10-02-2007, 11:35 AM

I'm still waiting for Dave to actually address the issue of the 2 vs. the 14. I really want to see his argument how one instruction to gather up two of every sort of animal (including, specifically, cattle, which are classified as "clean") is not inconsistent with a second instruction to gather up two of all "unclean" animals and fourteen of all "clean" animals.

If I were Noah, I wouldn't know whether I was supposed to bring two cows or fourteen cows, and I'm very interested to see what Dave thinks is the right number here.

Anything to say, Dave? If you think you've already "addressed" this issue (as distinct from merely claiming you would at some point in the future address it), I'd appreciate a link.

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10-02-2007, 10:18 AM	#532
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	It was a bit sarcastic, but I don't think that Christians who witness are autistic. I think that the act of witnessing may look anti-social to those being witnesses to, but there is a lot more to autism.

10-02-2007, 11:35 AM	#540
ericmurphy Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 3,027	I'm still waiting for Dave to actually address the issue of the 2 vs. the 14. I really want to see his argument how one instruction to gather up two of every sort of animal (including, specifically, cattle, which are classified as "clean") is not inconsistent with a second instruction to gather up two of all "unclean" animals and fourteen of all "clean" animals. If I were Noah, I wouldn't know whether I was supposed to bring two cows or fourteen cows, and I'm very interested to see what Dave thinks is the right number here. Anything to say, Dave? If you think you've already "addressed" this issue (as distinct from merely claiming you would at some point in the future address it), I'd appreciate a link.

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