fast

I'm a white male that happens to know a minimum wage elderly black mother of 4 that is VERY DEEP in debt--so deep in fact that eating chicken is a monthly treat. She pays her bills on time (and always has) only with the GREAT support of others she considers family.

She doesn't have the luxury of buying a soda, and rice is given to her, for affording it is problematic.

She pays $100.00 (used to be $200.00) a month in tides. Her children has been taught to pay tides. $350.00 a month is given to the church practically EVERY MONTH.

To theists and atheists (especially theists): Do take a stand and explain to me what it is I am missing here! This grandmother now explains that her children does not do WITHOUT.

Her children has food, shoes, cloths, shelter bla bla, but they can't go out and buy a steak because they do not have the money. I look at religion and other followers as the cause for this. I want--I demand--explanation!

Plognark

...



Wait, you mean tithes, right?

Well...churches aren't really about helping people. They're financial instituations like anything else, but specifically prey on human decency. Fortunately, people are often actually decent and some good deeds get done. And then there are stories like yours.

I understand that this type of issue is especially common in South America.

fast

Now that I check the dictionary, yes!

I do mean tithe!

Tuvar Ane Ingolenen

tithe
That means her household recieves about $3500 monthly (right?)

fast

I have unintentionally mislead the readers; I will explain.

The Mother and child no. 4 live and pay bills with approximately a $1,000/mo income. Her bills exceed $2,000.00+++/mo

Child no. 1 and 3 each live on their own (with there own bills) and make even less than $1,000.00/mo

Child no. 2 probably makes about $1,500.00/mo.

We have 3 households worth of bills in this equation. So, about 4,500.00 worth of income and less than 10% of that towards tithes.

The mother's debt (90,000.00+) bills were made directly by either purchasing only necessities or by helping out other chuch members in need. She ought to learn to say "no" sometimes, but as a child she had been told no, and "her lord" guides her to help others even when doing so places her deeper in debt.

When one cannot pay, someone else (usually the mother's mother) or friends
jump in to rescue the other.

Whether my interpretation of this reflects reality or not is not the point. None of this is the point. The point is that she CANNOT affort tithes, yet she finds a way to pay them never-the-less.

How can she claim not to afford a damn chicken wing yet remain steadfast in her desire to ensure that she and her children pay their tithes?

tithe n. one tenth; a tax or contribution for the support of the clergy and the church; any tax or levy -- vt. to give or pay a tithe

PS. Is "tithes" pronounced "tides"?

Plognark

Nah, i've always heard it pronounces "tithes"...but people you know could very easily screw up the pronunciation :huh:

Now worries, we knew what you were getting at

nermal

I'm certainly no fan of giving churches money, but you mention that she receives a great amount of assistance from those she considers family. Could that be the people of the church as well? It may well be that she's getting considerably more than 200 bucks a month return on what she's giving the church, in food, assistance, clothing, church members doing home repairs etc.

You could call it a form of exploitation, I suppose, but I'd bet that she, and the other members of her church (judging by your location) consider that tithe a gift to god, and it's not a simple "you give us our due, and we'll give you a hand out." More like a show of faith.

The bottom line, as I see it, is, would she be better off pocketing that 200 bucks a month, or is she better off involved with that church, financially speaking?

I don't like it, but I can understand how it works, and I don't see anything insidious in this particular case. Now, if she were giving her money to the likes of Falwell, ...

Ed

Shake

I had a Xian co-worker once who said of finances to:

1. Pay god
2. Pay yourself (i.e. put something in the bank)
3. Pay your bills

... in that order. I prefer to eliminate the first step, leaving more for the latter two.

Also, tithe is pronounced like it looks if you broke it up. Think "tie" and "the" (short "e"), and put them together.

seebs

A lot of churches push this. It can't even be dismissed as legalism; they've got it all wrong. First off, the 10% tithe is to be spent on whatever you want two years out of three, it's only given to the priests in the third year. Secondly, it doesn't apply now that we are no longer expecting the Levites to maintain the temple and feed the poor on our behalf.

In short, shoddy theology.

Ponzi

It sounds to me like the church should be giving her money, not taking it. Aren't Christians supposed to be charitable?