spin

Josephus claims knowledge of all three groups yet produces only detailed information of the Essenes. He claims to have chosen Pharisaism, yet produces much more on the Essenes. Josephus tended to weave sources into his accounts and didn't always acknowledge them. He doesn't acknowledge using 1 Maccabees as his major source for that period, yet weaves in other materials not found in 1 Maccabees. If we look at what he supplies for the Pharisees and the Sadducees, it should be easy to see that he has a source for the Essenes. (The source is usually assumed to be Nicolaus of Damascus.)

He only used a written source for the Essenes. When a writer uses various literary sources he often introduces errors through conflict with other materials.

Adolf Hitler was Austrian, finished up as chancellor of Germany. The French scientist Marie Curie started her life as Maria Sklodovska in Poland. Etc. Our sources tell us that the Essenes were pacifists, "ministers of peace" according to Josephus -- and Philo has a similar comment.


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Rick Sumner

Ah, touché.

But if John the Essene was such an exception, shouldn't we expect some sort of note of this remarkable transformation?

Christians are frequently acclaimed for their peacefulness in antiquity, and yet we find apocalyptic literature aplenty.

You're beginning to persuade me, but I still don't find the argument that they couldn't have written 1QM terribly persuasive. More troubling to the EH, at least in my opinion, is the near universally proclaimed hatred for pretty well everybody who wasn't a part of the community. I think an Essene could have written 1QM, but could have one written 1QS? Now that you point that out, I'm not sure they could have.

Regards,
Rick Sumner

spin

Why? Did you ever ask why the hitman Legs Diamond was called "Legs"? Did anyone care why this ex-dancer made such a remarkable transformation? Someone who might have been a carpenter's apprentice gets called Chips all his life even though he never finished his apprenticeship. Remarkable transformations go by unnoticed remarkably often.

Apocalypses are very different from what the War Scroll is. They talk of hard times that will befall everyone, not that xians are going to fight wars. Besides, while the literature might have Jesus not being particularly war-like, the religion has never minded fighting:

I came not to send peace, but a sword

There are several copies of the War Scroll. It is a seminal document in the corpus dealing with a bellicose minded group, yet our classical descriptions of the Essenes do not allow them to be such a group.

Much of the logic of the scrolls community is maintaining separation in order to preserve purity. MMT is all about separation and purity: mixing is bad being the key theme. It's not a hatred so much for most outsiders (except those who fall away or are in open conflict). One simply couldn't mix with them for one would become impure. The people of the scrolls community maintained temple purity.

Could an Essene have written the pro status-quo temple structure of the priesthood as found at the beginning of 1QM col.2? Weren't the Essenes estranged from the temple?

I don't think your analogy with xians and apocalypses is functional. The xians weren't pacifists and apocalypses aren't directly related to 1QM, a type of manual for conducting a war.


spin

Rick Sumner

Touché again.

"Very different" is a bit of an overstatement, but I see your point.

1QS is emphatic in proscribing hatred for outsiders though (something likewise observed in Josephus about the Essenes, however, so perhaps not as problematic as I'd originally thought--been awhile since I'd read Josephus on the Essenes). They are, to my knowledge (as I recently noted on Ebla), the only Jewish group who actually endorsed hatred for their enemies.

I don't know if one could or not. I'll look into it further. What of War.2.139 though? ". . .that he will ever show fidelity to all men, and especially to those in authority, because no one obtains the government without God's assistance."

Again, I see your point

Regards,
Rick Sumner