Magus55

But Jesus performed miracles and people still didn't believe He was God. I should have clarified I guess and said, what makes you think with plenty of evidence, you would believe?

And of course, thats probably one reason God can't be proven. Would you really reject Him if you knew for a fact He existed, and Hell was your current fate? God doesn't want people to follow Him for the sole purpose of avoiding Hell. That isn't love, its following out of fear.

Skyfurnace

I think I should bring this quote up for comparison:

How do you know Jesus performed miricles? Do you go back in time and witness them for yourself?

Quote:

And of course, thats probably one reason God can't be proven. Would you really reject Him if you knew for a fact He existed, and Hell was your current fate? God doesn't want people to follow Him for the sole purpose of avoiding Hell. That isn't love, its following out of fear.

You're basically saying that God's existence shouldn't be proven because then people would simply follow him to avoid hell. Now, I hate to sound blunt, but it sounds kind of ironic that God wouldn't want his existence to be proven. That seems like a very clever way of saying, "God doesn't actually exist."

Godless Wonder

I picked this part out because this kind of thing really rubs me the wrong way. There are a number of places in the bible where it talks about the ways of God being purposely foolish to confound the wise, and so forth, and then you hear stuff like this, about having to think like a 4 year old in order to believe the Bible. It's not only not convincing, in fact, it has the opposite effect, it just makes it all seem to me like deliberate lies. (Just as God intended for me, no doubt. ) <-- Hey, I finally took time to learn how to do a smiley

A 4 year old can believe in lots of things: Santa, the tooth fairy, the Easter Bunny, an imaginary friend. "If a 4 year old can do it, an adult can too." The fact that a 4 year old is capable of believing something doesn't say much about that something.

Mr. Neutron

Well, the average Rapture Ready Board member is at roughly the same intellectual level as the average 4-year old, so that doesn't really mean anything.

Asha'man

This is precisely my objection to the Bible itself, why I cannot accept that it has any form of divine guidance behind it. It is confusing, contradictory, vague, irrelevant, and subject to all forms of interpretation. In short, it displays every characteristic of a book written by man, and not one single characteristic of a book written by an omnimax entity.

A real holy book would provide answers to anyone who read it. A real holy book would provide consistent answers to all who read it. A real holy book would not be translated, since every reader would perceive the text in his own native language. A real holy book would clearly state the answers to important questions, not dance around the issue with vague unfulfilled prophecy and parables that are easily misunderstood. A real holy book would provide answers that are consistent with reality.

If God has a message to deliver, he has failed spectacularly to deliver it. 20,000 denominations of Christianity alone are rock solid proof of that, as are the 2/3rds of the people of Earth that are non-Christian.

I’m sure someone will bring up the free will defense (they always do), but I reject that utterly. If the Bible is what the Christians say it is, then it already destroys your free will. Alternately, it is impossible to make an honest decision if you don’t have all the information, a choice made in ignorance is not truly free.


The reason Christians say that we must believe in advance is simple: they have no choice. The Bible is clearly not a true holy book, the evidence for God is clearly non-existent. Only by brainwashing can you be convinced otherwise, so they try to make brainwashing into a good thing. It’s an act of desperation in the face of a reality that doesn’t agree with their beliefs.

Amlodhi

The part I have trouble believing is that a 4 year old can read the bible.

Magus55

Yup they can, which doesn't lend itself very much to the reading ability of atheists. Guess being like a child is a virtue after all.

Abel Stable

Maybe I'm just slow, but I was still learning the alphabet and everything when I was 4. I also thought Jesus was a woman for awhile, at least until I started sunday school at 6 or so, but those memories are a bit foggy.

conkermaniac

I read the Bible when I was 4 or 5, but it was a children's Bible. Even then I didn't really understand it, and by the time I was 8 or 9, I had already forgotten most of the stories. You just show me a 4 year-old who can define half the words used in the Bible, and I'll be impressed.

bleubird

The bible,to this date still is a lode of redacted,revised,edited,catholic fish shit.
pices.

bleubird