mountainman

Most of which stand in line behind Conybeare's thesis to salvage the integrity of "VC"
from being treated as a 4th century forgery by surmising that it depicts a genuine Christian Jewish sect.


Is it not also important to understand a little better the relationship between Eusebius and Philo?

How did Eusebius use Philo in the 4th century?

Philonic Allusions in Eusebius, PE 7.7-8
Aaron P. Johnson
The Classical Quarterly
Vol. 56, No. 1 (May, 2006) (pp. 239-248)

Here are some rough notes:
Eusebius PE Book 7.

Robert Tulip

Happily, a goodly portion of Taylor's discussion on the Therapeuts is available at google books.

Taylor states
I have noticed that fear of Jews is widespread, especially among American politicians who are a very timid breed. I like Jews, but I think there is a lot of dishonesty about them. This thread illustrates how fear of Jews leads people to falsely claim all Therapeuts were Jews just as fear of Christians leads people to say Jesus was real.

Taylor, cited by Huller as the last word on the Therapeuts, says "Philo is not only referring to Jews." That seems quite authoritative. Taylor also cites Zacharias Thundy, disagreeing with his assertion the Therapeuts were "indigenised Buddhists." But Taylor does say
Many people remain locked in what we could call a 'white racist' paradigm, in which influences from outside the west are denied. This is a key theme in Bernal's Black Athena. So, people claim that Philo says the Therapeuts were a Jewish group, even though Philo said no such thing, and only emphasised the strong Therapeut interest in Judaism. This desperate Judaising of the Therapeuts taps into a bigger cultural myth of western autonomy from the east.

mountainman

She and her peers, you and your peers, and on the surface the bulk of modern scholarship are content in not questioning the basic hypothesis that "VC" is a genuine testimony from the 1st century and not, as some have claimed last century, a forged testimony from the 4th century.

One element of the OP and discussion is to explore is the possibility that "VC" is a late fabrication that was immediately put into service by the Eusebian propaganda machine.

See the above post #760, link, cites and extract from

Philonic Allusions in Eusebius, PE 7.7-8
Aaron P. Johnson
The Classical Quarterly
Vol. 56, No. 1 (May, 2006) (pp. 239-248)

stephan huller

I like Jews but ...

Spoken like a true anti-Semite. The 'fear of Jews' leads to ... a conspiracy. Really? One needs to find a conspiracy to explain why someone would accept that 'Philo the Jew' mentioning approvingly a group with obvious Jewish practices and customs (find me one other non-Jewish group with a 364 day calendar) in the context of a treatise which is by mountainman's own witness virulently anti-pagan. Sure, they must own all the banks too.

Sheshbazzar

Platonisim was a pagan religious philosophy.

Neoplatonism was a pagan religious philosphy.

Epicureanism was a pagan religious philosophy.

stephan huller

But it wasn't a pagan religion and it wasn't idolatrous. The argument was that Plato learned from Moses about the Jewish god. It was monotheistic. It would impossible for a Jew to reconcile himself to worship a demi-god like Asclepius. There is no evidence that the Therapeutae were Buddhist.

aa5874

Actually she does state what you DON'T want to hear.

The very Taylor did write that the Therapeutae was a universal sect or philosophy--not just Jews.

Toto

That quote is not exactly accurate. If you go to the source, you can see that Taylor is stating that Philo is speaking of universal values. She is not saying that the particular group that he calls Therapeutae includes non-Jews.

This whole paragraph is just bizarre. American politicians have respect and/or fear for any organized group that can command sympathy and campaign contributions from American voters. That's how the system works. I don't see the connection between fear of Christians and belief in a historical Jesus, and even less a connection between fear of Jews and belief that a Jewish writer is describing a group of Jews.

Taylor's statement was not in regard to the membership in the group he describes as Therapeutae

I think that a white racist would want to de-Judaize the Therapeutae. White racists tend not to like Jews. They tend to fear them and attribute special powers to them.

But we would prefer that you stick to the evidence without imagining motivations behind fellow posters.

Sheshbazzar

There is no evidence that Plato the pagan philosopher was ever Jewish.

There is evidence that Philo embraced and syncretized the pagan philosophies.

Where does the Jewish religion teach that there should be a shrine 'in every house' ?

Does your Torah or LXX text command; 'In every house there is to be sacred shrine which is called the holy place' ?

According to Philo Alexandrian Therapeutae had " 'In every house a sacred shrine which is called the holy place'.

This is Jewish practice? since when? Think they had a Madonna and baby Jebus stuck in that shrine too?

stephan huller

of course Plato wasn't jewish by race