PhilVaz

It's my understanding Kersey Graves accepted not only the historical Jesus, but that the pagan gods he was supposedly patterned after were real / historical as well. Although I'm trying to read through this book (it's painful) I have the edition published by Adventures Unlimited Press, 2001.

On page 1 in the forward by Acharya S she writes: "...Graves's hypothesis [is] that these various godmen were all 'historical personages' who patterned themselves after this archetype..." also that "...[Graves] was an evermerist, i.e. one who believes that these various crucified saviors and godmen were 'real people' who were deified with fairytales and myths added to their biographies. He was therefore not a mythicist...." (page 1, 7 of The Worlds Sixteen Crucified Saviors). So looks like Graves himself believed Jesus "the man" was historical.

I'm dealing with some of this in my article on the parallel pagan gods and historical Jesus evidence.

Phil P

Steve Weiss

Zeus and Thor will be happy when everyone recognizes them as real. Just look underneath your bed. They're there; I'm sure of it.

GakuseiDon

That website looks good. Looks like you plan on it being very comprehensive.

Rick Sumner

I don't know that I would be as quick to call Ehrman "standard literature" in the study of the historical Jesus as you are. Certainly he wouldn't appear as a required text in many undergraduate courses on the matter, save perhaps one he was teaching. A good read, but a "standard?" Probably not.

Regards,
Rick Sumner

PhilVaz

GDon << That website looks good. Looks like you plan on it being very comprehensive. >>

Hey thanks, you're the GDon of the site I link to responding to Brian Flemming's DVD. Good job! Your Analysis

I just got his DVD late last year and I'm a newbie to these kinds of "Jesus myth" arguments. I don't post very much on these boards. My home is the Catholic Answers boards. Your article and J.P. Holding's more comprehensive material was helpful. I'm doing my own research though so we'll see if Jesus holds up. I actually go to the library (Univ of South FL) unlike Flemming.

Phil P

Johann_Kaspar

Here you have one first answer:It could be useful to read some French authors... Dupuis is prepared by a complete row of French thinkers of the 18th century.

I am again quite surprised by the ignorance of US people (in general) about the French authors. Like if US authors want to make think that they discovered the wheel, and of course get the fame for this. It is disappointing to read people "discovering" things already well known by German or French authors, or ignoring completely the research done this side of the pond.

Malachi151

This shouldn't be a big surprise, #1 America never had a large French population, #2 France is primarily Catholic or atheistic, two things that prevented much French thought from penetrating America, #3 French works seem to have been translated into English less than German works, either because the French wanted them to be read in French or perhaps because of English and French antagonisms.

The single largest ethnic group in America is German, so it should be no surprise that we have more in common with Germany and that our universities have a more German background. Plus, it seems that a lot of German works were translated into English, plus also the 19th c and early 20th c explosion in German science and chemistry resulted in a lot of use of German works and respect of German scholarship in our universities as well. More people here spoke German in the 18th and 19th c, and, of course, Germany was Protestant, not Catholic.

So, there are quite explainable reasons behind this.

I just thought of this, but it is ironic. France has been hampered to some degree because there are not many French Americans, and American is so dominant that we influence world events and Americans just don't care much for France and we have so few French people that this is easy, but why do we have so few French people? Because of all the nations of Europe, France was doing the best during the 19th and early 20th c, so few French people had a reason to leave to come to America. We got a lot of Germans, Irish, Italians, and Russians because conditions in those countries got intolerable, but since France was better off, fewer people left and came here.

In the long run, those periods of misery have benefited those counties because they caused more people to come to America, and thus America has aided those countries more since, though this didn't happen so much with Russia due to the Cold War, etc.

GakuseiDon

Well, I'm an Australian, so this is the ignorance of an Australian here.

Any idea who Dupuis referenced on the subject? It would be interesting to find out who originated the "Christ myth" concept, at least as far back as we can go.

mountainman

From the definitions of "myth" used by Remsburg that you quoted above,
in which provision is clearly made for "fiction", then the precedence must
be granted to Emperor Julian, circa 362 CE. (Setting aside Arius, 325 CE)

GakuseiDon

I think you've been in Falls Creek a bit too long, MM. I'm in Melbourne. Come down to sea level, the extra oxygen might be beneficial.