Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Ion · 01-04-2004, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Picture

...
To Ion:

At the time of God's proclaimation, it was good, isn't it?

No it wasn't.

At the time of a proclamation, all the design of a creation -including any consequence of the creation- has to be "...good...".

When a consequence of a creation disproves the creation, then the creator designed a no good creation.

Magus55 · 01-04-2004, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kosh
Stop with the BS, Picture. Do you want to be held legally accountable for anything your father/grandfather/great-grandfather may have done wrong?

Get yourself into the modern times and start thinking for yourself.

Adam never existed. The earth is more than 6000 years old, and it's scary to think that you're in college and aren't getting a proper education.

First of all, you are not held accountable for your ancestors wrongdoings. You are held accountable for your own. You just happen to be predisposed to sin. Think of it as genetic.

And please provide proof that there was no Adam. Science is already tracing the beginnings of humanity to a bottleneck surrounding one woman.

Ion · 01-04-2004, 08:18 PM

Any proof of this, from outside of the religious Bible, Magus55?

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55

...
You just happen to be predisposed to sin.
...

Because without proof for this from outside the religious Bible, your claim is preaching religion and is null intelligence-wise.

Kosh · 01-04-2004, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
And please provide proof that there was no Adam. Science is already tracing the beginnings of humanity to a bottleneck surrounding one woman.

<sigh> Magus you have already been beaten down on this very topic in another thread (one of the many which you've abandoned after an ass whooping).

Once again for the lurkers, the "bottleneck" to which Magus refers is believed to have occurred 70,000 years ago, and triggered by a massive volcanic eruption which caused worldwide havoc in the ecosystem. IIRC, it was the Yellowstone caldera, in Wyoming.

Now Magus, do you still believe that the Sinai is full of sand dunes like the Sahara? If so, it's because you abonded this this thread without reading it completely.

Quote:

Too easy.... - Darth Vader

Magus, please provide proof that there was no Zeus.

Ion · 01-04-2004, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55

...
And please provide proof that there was no Adam.
...

Adam lived what, 900 years?

The science doesn't support anyone living hundreds of years.

So, Adam's life is unsupported by science.

Adam's life is only claimed by religion.

Which is not a reference in knowledge.

Magus55 · 01-04-2004, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ion
Adam lived what, 900 years?

The science doesn't support anyone living hundreds of years.

So, Adam's life is unsupported by science.

Adam's life is only claimed by religion.

Which is not a reference in knowledge.

Incorrect. No one today currently lives to 900 years old. That in no way means someone in the past didn't. That isn't proof sorry.

Ion · 01-04-2004, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Incorrect. No one today currently lives to 900 years old. That in no way means someone in the past didn't. That isn't proof sorry.

Incorrect.

All fossils of human skeletons are of humans who died in less than 100 years of life.

Science never found human life longer than 122 years, and doesn't support it.

So, Adam is unsupported by science, too.

Jack the Bodiless · 01-05-2004, 02:26 AM

Magus55:

Quote:

First of all, you are not held accountable for your ancestors wrongdoings. You are held accountable for your own. You just happen to be predisposed to sin. Think of it as genetic.

...How quickly you forget!

You gave a non-answer and then fled when I last confronted you with this very contradiction.

According to the Bible, we ARE and ARE NOT responsible for the wrongdoings of our ancestors.

On the YES side:

Quote:

Gen.9:21-25 "And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father .... And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. And he said, Cursed be Canaan [Ham's son]; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren."

Ex.20:5 , Dt.5:9 "I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation."

Ex.34:7 "Visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children unto the third and to the fourth generation."

Num.14:18 "Visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation."

Dt.28:18 "Cursed shall be the fruit of thy body."

2 Sam.12:14 "The child also that is born unto thee shall surely die."

2 Sam.21:6-9 Let seven men of his sons be delivered unto us, and we will hang them up unto the LORD .... And he delivered them into the hands of the Gibeonites, and they hanged them in the hill before the LORD."

1 Kg.2:33 "Their blood shall therefore return upon the head of Joab, and upon the head of his seed for ever."

1 Kg.21:29 "Seest thou how Ahab humbleth himself before me? because he humbleth himself before me, I will not bring the evil in his days: but in his son's days will I bring the evil upon his house."

2 Kg.5:27 "The leprosy therefore of Naaman shall cleave unto thee, and unto thy seed for ever."

Is.14:21 "Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers."

Jer.16:10-11 "Wherefore hath the Lord pronounced all this great evil against us? ... Because your fathers have forsaken me, saith the Lord."

Jer.29:32 "Therefore thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will punish Shemaiah the Nehelamite, and his seed."

Jer.32:18 "Thou ... recompensest the iniquity of the fathers into the bosom of their children after them."

On the NO side:

Quote:

Dt.24:16 "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin."

Jer.31:29-30 In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children's teeth are set on edge. But every one shall die for his own iniquity."

Ezek.18:20 "The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him."

Amaleq13 · 01-05-2004, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Picture
But the bible does say that satan came in the form of a serpent...

It doesn't say that in Genesis. Except for being able to talk, the serpent is described as a serpent and nothing more.

Amaleq13 · 01-05-2004, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Science is already tracing the beginnings of humanity to a bottleneck surrounding one woman.

This is a common misunderstanding (I blame Newsweek

). The "bottleneck" is understood to be a tribe of people, all of whom were related to the same woman. They did not all descend from her but were related to her and the evidence continues to exist in our genes today.

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