Freethought & Rationalism Archive

UncleJim · 09-06-2005, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay GW

There's no way to know how much information is being absorbed under or outside your awareness, is there?

There are two methods or ways that information enters a human brain. First it enters by sensual experience with reality and secondly it enters by sensual experience with another's voice.

The first method is absolute. Sensual experience with reality is the method of all life forms and it is not subject to error (assuming that the sense organs are functioning normally).

The second is error prone since it depends on the intention of the speaker and is therefore not dependent on reality for its truth. If a person hears nothing but the sounds of another’s voice (or that persons writings) this person has no gauge by which to judge if what he is hearing (or reading) is true or not. Since the actions of a human body are determined by the content of his brain these persons actions may not be in accordance to what is true and may result in their own death.

Verloc · 09-06-2005, 10:53 AM

You're kill not the brainwashed. president

DRFseven · 09-06-2005, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay GW

There's no way to know how much information is being absorbed under or outside your awareness, is there?

Nope.

StaticAge · 09-06-2005, 12:18 PM

I say nuetral/maybe. It is possible to convince oneself of anything that appeals to oneself, regardless of the popularity of an idea or the amount of presence it has externally. It is also possible to reassess formerly held ideas and reverse position. People do these things all the time on many different levels. Are your friends your friends because you selected them freely or did they brainwash you into liking them? Do you have affection for anyone because they are your family, and is such affection brainwashing? Do you feel a romantic connection with someone, and is it because they are the best person for you or because you convinced yourself that they are? To me, these questions are more impressive than what kind of music or clothing we wear or social customs we adopt.

seangirl · 09-07-2005, 04:16 PM

I said strongly disagree pretty quickly. I may be misinformed or have wrongly assumed things out of naivete' but I am not brainwashed. A brainwashed individual continues to believe or practice something even after that something is exposed as a lie, joke or hoax. I worked at this comedy club once and this Comedian/Hypnotist would hypnotise audience members. It was a riot. I talked to him one night (after sex...just kidding) and he told me some people are more suggestable than others.

seangirl · 09-07-2005, 04:17 PM

very funny!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verloc

You're kill not the brainwashed. president

David B · 09-07-2005, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay GW

Brainwashing:

Intensive, forcible indoctrination, usually political or religious, aimed at destroying a person's basic convictions and attitudes and replacing them with an alternative set of fixed beliefs.

The application of a concentrated means of persuasion, such as an advertising campaign or repeated suggestion, in order to develop a specific belief or motivation.
___

How do you know that your basic beliefs haven't been formed by something besides your conscious choices?

Which ones have and which ones haven't? How do you know?

If this were a courtroom (in Alice in Wonderland) for example, and you were asked to "prove" that your beliefs, values, convictions were the result of your own reasoned, rational, logical decisions ----- could you?

Many times what a persuader will do is first convince you that your ideas aren't the "truth" but lies that have been fed to you. It seems to work for advertisers, cults and dictatorships!

Are any choices made consciously?

What does 'consciously' mean, anyway?

David B (suggests that constant reality checks and a sceptical stance improve one's chances of getting things right)

View Poll Results: My beliefs and values are solely the result of my conscious choices.
Strongly agree	11	19.30%
Somewhat agree	15	26.32%
Neutral/Maybe	11	19.30%
Somewhat disagree	7	12.28%
Strongly disagree	13	22.81%
Voters: 57. You have already voted on this poll

09-07-2005, 04:16 PM	#25
seangirl New Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: ohio Posts: 2	Brainwashed? I said strongly disagree pretty quickly. I may be misinformed or have wrongly assumed things out of naivete' but I am not brainwashed. A brainwashed individual continues to believe or practice something even after that something is exposed as a lie, joke or hoax. I worked at this comedy club once and this Comedian/Hypnotist would hypnotise audience members. It was a riot. I talked to him one night (after sex...just kidding) and he told me some people are more suggestable than others.

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09-06-2005, 10:53 AM	#22
Verloc Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Toronto Posts: 742	You're kill not the brainwashed. president

09-06-2005, 12:18 PM	#24
StaticAge Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Washington DC Posts: 667	I say nuetral/maybe. It is possible to convince oneself of anything that appeals to oneself, regardless of the popularity of an idea or the amount of presence it has externally. It is also possible to reassess formerly held ideas and reverse position. People do these things all the time on many different levels. Are your friends your friends because you selected them freely or did they brainwash you into liking them? Do you have affection for anyone because they are your family, and is such affection brainwashing? Do you feel a romantic connection with someone, and is it because they are the best person for you or because you convinced yourself that they are? To me, these questions are more impressive than what kind of music or clothing we wear or social customs we adopt.

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