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Old 05-21-2005, 12:32 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewcriddle
The quote is on p 8 of The Secret Gospel it is giving general background to Smith's interest in esoteric religion it is not talking about Smith's discoveries at Mar Saba.

Andrew Criddle
Thanks for looking it up, Andrew. Smith does mention his find of the Scholia a few pages later on page 12, though, right? And I believe he may, there, only refer to the date of the book in which he found the scholia as 18th century rather than using the specifiic 1746 date. Are the two things (ie. on p8 and p12) totally disconnected in context? Oh well, interesting coincidence either way, I suppose....
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Old 05-21-2005, 01:01 PM   #32
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From your link on the Baal Shem Tov

Baal Shem Tov = Master of the Good Name.

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The title Baal Shem (Master of the Name) was used for holy men who were known as miracle workers since they used the power of the Name of God to work miracles.
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Old 05-21-2005, 01:17 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Haran
I was wondering why you translated EUCAI as 'blessings'? I thought EULOGIA translated as 'blessings' and EUCAI was the plural of EUCH (which is derived from EUCOMAI) and means 'prayers', or 'vows'.
I went with its modern meaning; it also means prayers and vows. Lampe's Patristic Greek Lexicon has a huge entry on it. I don't know enough about the Orthodox liturgical practices to identify what kind of prayers are in that book. My initial impression of the prayer on the page facing the scholia seems to be a blessing kind of prayer, but I haven't really looked at it closely.

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I have not been able to locate the word LUCNIKOU, after a brief search in Lidell-Scott, BDAG, and others. It appears to be related to lamp/lampstand, but the 'KOU' is throwing me at the moment. Do lamps/lampstands somehow signify vesper, or the evening?
It's in Lampe's. It's the time of day when you need to light your lamps.

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I suppose I would have translated it something like 'Prayers of the evening and of the dawn', in a somewhat literal fashion, or 'Evening and morning prayers' (of course, if LUCNIKOU can mean evening).... Am I wrong? Sorry, I know this is a hair off topic, but I love Greek and the opportunity to learn something I didn't know.
I could have gone with dusk and dawn, but vespers and matins seem to be the more usual monastic terms in English.
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Old 05-21-2005, 01:20 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haran
'Evening and morning prayers'
That's how Smith characterized the contents of the book (Secret Gospel, p. 12).
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Old 05-21-2005, 04:38 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by S.C.Carlson
I went with its modern meaning; it also means prayers and vows. Lampe's Patristic Greek Lexicon has a huge entry on it.
That would explain my confusion. I'm mostly unfamiliar with modern Greek.

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It's in Lampe's. It's the time of day when you need to light your lamps.
Thanks! I've heard of Lampe's lexicon but never used it. I guess I thought BDAG was one of the definitive Greek lexicons, even for patristic literature, so I normally go to it.

...yet another book I need to add to my ever growing library.
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Old 05-21-2005, 05:01 PM   #36
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...Or then again, maybe I'll just make a trip to the local Seminary library for the time being.

Lampe's Patristic Greek Lexicon
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Old 05-21-2005, 06:09 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haran
...Or then again, maybe I'll just make a trip to the local Seminary library for the time being.

Lampe's Patristic Greek Lexicon
Cool smilie! But a used copy is only $324.97 !
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Old 05-22-2005, 04:53 AM   #38
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Cool smilie! But a used copy is only $324.97 !
Alright!

Heh...I love that little guy and his song! (My apologies to those who don't...)
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Old 05-22-2005, 05:41 AM   #39
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Just for fun, I thought I'd run SecMark through my chiastic rules for Mark. As if I had nothing better to be doing...

A: "And they come into Bethany.
...B: And a certain woman whose brother had died was there.
......C: And, coming, she prostrated herself before Jesus and says to him, 'Son of David, have mercy on me.'
.........D: But the disciples rebuked her.
.............E: And Jesus, being angered, went off with her into the garden where the tomb was, and straightway a great cry was heard from the tomb.
...............F: And going near Jesus rolled away the stone from the door of the tomb.
...............F: And straightway, going in where the youth was, he stretched forth his hand and raised him, seizing his hand.
............E: But the youth, looking upon him, loved him and began to beseech him that he might be with him.
.........D: And going out of the tomb they came into the house of the youth, for he was rich.
......C: And after six days Jesus told him what to do and in the evening the youth comes to him, wearing a linen cloth over his naked body.
...B: And he remained with him that night, for Jesus taught him the mystery of the kingdom of God.
A: And thence, arising, he returned to the other side of the Jordan."

As can easily be seen, this is not a Markan structure.
Markan structures fold back on themselves in the center to form a neat doublet that contains no simple repetition.
The rhythm is all wrong, and the long narrative is not broken up with dialogue.
There are no scriptural citations, allusions, or references. Yet 25% of Mark consists of such.
The verse "for he was rich" looks like an explanation, but actually is not (Why should they go to his house because he was rich?). In real Mark such clauses frequently summarize the previous action, or add a real explanation of the action.
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Old 05-22-2005, 06:53 AM   #40
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Quote:
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Cool smilie! But a used copy is only $324.97 !
Gee, that's more expensive than a used copy of Voss's first edition of the genuine epistles of Ignatius.
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