Freethought & Rationalism Archive

ex-xian · 01-05-2004, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sophie
ex-xian : Wrong on both counts.

The thread consists of aposteriori evidence from Canada of some philosophical hypothesis called conscience which I claimed was natural to me. Followed by whether this so-called conscience was complete without altruism, that is its correspondence and existential bearing on the external world.

Conscience may be construed as a moral, but to us philosophers we try to find if there is any apriori evidence for its existing in a natural state prior to societal implications.

If you already knew the answer by moving the thread, perhaps you can be kind enough to supply the damm answer.

Kindly tone down the rhetoric. If you object to my moderation, I suggest you start a thread inBugs, Problems, and Complaints.

sophie · 01-05-2004, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Kindly tone down the rhetoric

What on Earth are you talking about - rhetoric. How on Earth does an explaination demanded by you become rhetoric? This is not a fool's paradise, this is a philosophical discussion for hard thinkers or so they said !

ex-xian · 01-05-2004, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sophie
What on Earth are you talking about - rhetoric. How on Earth does an explaination demanded by you become rhetoric? This is not a fool's paradise, this is a philosophical discussion for hard thinkers or so they said !

Please post in Bugs to discuss this further. I would not the topic of the thread to become derailed to the point that it warrants closure.

variant 13 · 01-05-2004, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Conscience : the part of the superego in psychoanalysis that transmits commands and admonitions to the ego.

First off forget psychoanalysis it was invented by a psycho.

AS for the conscience itself?

Nice idea, just not strong enough. Think of it as empathy in action.

tronvillain · 01-05-2004, 06:28 PM

Yes, no one ever attempts to right wrongs here in Canada.

DRFseven · 01-06-2004, 09:37 AM

Sophie, are you familiar with Damasio's theory of somatic markers? I ask because somatic markers describe the "pang of conscience". The gist of it is that the brain forms a mental representation of the body and of the body's relationship with the environment. A big part of this process is emotional memory. Emotional memories are memories of events that are charged with emotion to an extent that the emotion is permanently "attached" to the memory of the event; even if the conscious memory of the event is lost, the emotion remains. Example: As a very young child, you hit your brother over the head with a Tonka truck. Blood spurts, all hell breaks loose in the family, mother obviously scared, situation obviously serious, brother is taken to the hospital to be sewn up, etc. Years later, the thought of striking someone brings up feelings of shame, guilt, anger, horror because of everything that happened before. The important result is that, to you, uncalled-for violence = NO!!!, even if you don't think about the incident with little brother.

This is important because it leads to internalization of parental morals through conscience-building. We experience our parents reactions (whether they intend it or not) to life situations and by the internalization process, come to feel they those values are OUR values; that that is just the way we are. And they ARE our values because we can't get rid of them, except through unusual, extraordinary circumstances, such as cult-brainwashing or being thrown into traumatic situations.

sophie · 01-07-2004, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Sophie, are you familiar with Damasio's theory of somatic markers?

I am aware of a phenomena of this sort but had no idea it was called Damasio's theory of somatic markers.

I will try to respond in a meningful manner as soon as possible.

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01-05-2004, 06:28 PM	#15
tronvillain Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 5,658	Yes, no one ever attempts to right wrongs here in Canada.

01-06-2004, 09:37 AM	#16
DRFseven Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Posts: 2,322	Sophie, are you familiar with Damasio's theory of somatic markers? I ask because somatic markers describe the "pang of conscience". The gist of it is that the brain forms a mental representation of the body and of the body's relationship with the environment. A big part of this process is emotional memory. Emotional memories are memories of events that are charged with emotion to an extent that the emotion is permanently "attached" to the memory of the event; even if the conscious memory of the event is lost, the emotion remains. Example: As a very young child, you hit your brother over the head with a Tonka truck. Blood spurts, all hell breaks loose in the family, mother obviously scared, situation obviously serious, brother is taken to the hospital to be sewn up, etc. Years later, the thought of striking someone brings up feelings of shame, guilt, anger, horror because of everything that happened before. The important result is that, to you, uncalled-for violence = NO!!!, even if you don't think about the incident with little brother. This is important because it leads to internalization of parental morals through conscience-building. We experience our parents reactions (whether they intend it or not) to life situations and by the internalization process, come to feel they those values are OUR values; that that is just the way we are. And they ARE our values because we can't get rid of them, except through unusual, extraordinary circumstances, such as cult-brainwashing or being thrown into traumatic situations.

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