Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Dean Anderson · 10-09-2007, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clouseau

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayco

I've always wondered about this question and how Christians/Jews would combat it if someone actually did live past 120.

It's quite possible that this is nothing to do with longevity. It could mean that God would allow 120 years (a 'nice round figure' by Babylonian numeration) before sending the flood. The Living Bible takes this time as a 'grace period':

'Then Jehovah said, "My Spirit must not forever be disgraced in man, wholly evil as he is. I will give him 120 years to mend his ways."' Ge 6:3 TLB

That's an awful translation, obviously based far more on supporting evangelical theology and doctrine than on what the text actually says - in this case bearing little resemblance to the Hebrew.

Ray Moscow · 10-09-2007, 07:47 AM

I just released to Clouseau was quoting The Living Bible (a paraphrase) as being more accurate than the KJV (which, though flawed, is actually a decent translation for most purposes).

I prefer the RSV or NRSV over the KJV, but I usually quote from the KJV since most Protestant Christians accept it as at least reasonably accurate.

Clouseau · 10-09-2007, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean Anderson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clouseau

It's quite possible that this is nothing to do with longevity. It could mean that God would allow 120 years (a 'nice round figure' by Babylonian numeration) before sending the flood. The Living Bible takes this time as a 'grace period':

'Then Jehovah said, "My Spirit must not forever be disgraced in man, wholly evil as he is. I will give him 120 years to mend his ways."' Ge 6:3 TLB

Quote:

That's an awful translation,

Surely, Dean, you are aware that the LB is not a translation?

Clouseau · 10-09-2007, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Moscow

I just released to Clouseau was quoting The Living Bible (a paraphrase) as being more accurate than the KJV

Is that what you 'released', Ray? How on earth did you divine that message? Because it may have come from a lying spirit. It may be the same one that spoke to Muhammad, unless, of course, Muhammad could lie very well on his own, thank you.

Ray Moscow · 10-09-2007, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clouseau

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayco

I've always wondered about this question and how Christians/Jews would combat it if someone actually did live past 120.

It's quite possible that this is nothing to do with longevity. It could mean that God would allow 120 years (a 'nice round figure' by Babylonian numeration) before sending the flood. The Living Bible takes this time as a 'grace period':

'Then Jehovah said, "My Spirit must not forever be disgraced in man, wholly evil as he is. I will give him 120 years to mend his ways."' Ge 6:3 TLB

I should have said "realised".

However, you (Clouseau) are quoting TLB as an accurate rendition of the text.

Your disparaging remarks about the KJV are on other threads. However, you do know where TLB comes from, right?

Clouseau · 10-09-2007, 09:00 AM

[QUOTE=Ray Moscow;4852535]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clouseau

It's quite possible that this is nothing to do with longevity. It could mean that God would allow 120 years (a 'nice round figure' by Babylonian numeration) before sending the flood. The Living Bible takes this time as a 'grace period':

'Then Jehovah said, "My Spirit must not forever be disgraced in man, wholly evil as he is. I will give him 120 years to mend his ways."' Ge 6:3 TLB

Quote:

you (Clouseau) are quoting TLB as an accurate rendition of the text.

Falsehood, Ray. Address the topic, if that won't kill you.

Ray Moscow · 10-09-2007, 09:05 AM

[QUOTE=Clouseau;4852548]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Moscow

Falsehood, Ray. Address the topic, if that won't kill you.

The alternative explantion is that you were quoting TLB because you thought it to be an inaccurate rendering of the text.

Which is it?

Clouseau · 10-09-2007, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Moscow

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clouseau

The alternative explantion is that you were quoting TLB because you thought it to be an inaccurate rendering of the text.

False, too.

Ray Moscow · 10-09-2007, 09:50 AM

Then, perhaps it's that you think Kenneth Taylor had the right interpretation of Genesis 6:3, despite his lack of education in such matters? If so, why?

Sometimes laymen are right and scholars are wrong, but usually it's the other way around.

(I should add that Taylor claimed no special insight into the Hebrew text. He just re-worked the text to say what he thought it should say.)

Jayco · 10-09-2007, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

Methuseleh (sp)?

http://www.direct.ca/trinity/rule.html

There's an apologetics website that deals with "exceptions to the rule". Here's an excerpt:

Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.direct.ca/trinity/rule.html

However, when we read the original Hebrew of 2 Chronicles 24:15, we find the Jehoiada was in his 130th year when he died. He was not 130 years old but somewhere between 129 years old and 1 day less 130.

If we recalculate with this information:
129 years x 360 days = 46,440 days
46,440 days - 2,340 days (6.5 years of 360 days per year) = 44,100 days

44,100 days divided by 360 days per year = 122.5 years
129 years (360 days per year) - 6.5 years (360 days per year) = 122.5 years (360 days per year)

44,100 days divided by 365.25 days per year = 120.74 years

122.5 years (360 days per year) = 120.74 years (365.25 days per year)

Did God place our life span limit at 120 years of 365.25 days?

Did God also add extra years to Jehoiada's life above and beyond the 120-year rule that equaled the time he hid Joash in the temple?

Would God add years to a life? Just read Isaiah 38:5

We already see that the burial place of Jehoiada was an exception to the rule. It appears that his long life span was also an exception to the rule.

It seems like any theist can run loops around their holy text to suit their purposes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ksen

I don't think that 120 years was meant as some sort of ceiling for the lifespan of a human. I believe that God is talking about how much longer the earth had and the people alive at the time had before the flood would occur.

Is this coming from the TLB or your own personal reflections?

Also,

What's the Christian community say about this as a whole? Does Genesis 6:3, according to them, say it's a limit on lifespan or countdown till Deluge?

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10-09-2007, 07:47 AM	#12
Ray Moscow Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Surrey, England Posts: 1,255	I just released to Clouseau was quoting The Living Bible (a paraphrase) as being more accurate than the KJV (which, though flawed, is actually a decent translation for most purposes). I prefer the RSV or NRSV over the KJV, but I usually quote from the KJV since most Protestant Christians accept it as at least reasonably accurate.

10-09-2007, 09:50 AM	#19
Ray Moscow Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Surrey, England Posts: 1,255	Then, perhaps it's that you think Kenneth Taylor had the right interpretation of Genesis 6:3, despite his lack of education in such matters? If so, why? Sometimes laymen are right and scholars are wrong, but usually it's the other way around. (I should add that Taylor claimed no special insight into the Hebrew text. He just re-worked the text to say what he thought it should say.)

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