Freethought & Rationalism Archive

beanpie · 12-29-2003, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Just because one expert espouses a particular theory, that doesn't mean he was correct.

but, does that mean he is incorrect ?

beanpie · 12-30-2003, 09:42 AM

On the second voyage Columbus took to the West Indies, the people of Haiti told him that "black" people had been there before him. They showed him spears of these visitors, and further study of the metals involved in their construction showed that they could have been made only in one place: Guinea.

But let us say that we are wrong. Perhaps it is all just a coincidence; after all, there are no living survivors of the Native American Muslims, are they?

Wrong. And this last part is what originally drew me into this quest for knowledge: an expos� written by a Native Muslim.

Brother Mahir Abdal-Razzaaq El wrote in his account, recently posted on the Internet, about the Native Americans that were Muslims. He is of the Cherokee tribe; known as Eagle Sun Walker, and a Pipe Carrier Warrior of the Cherokees in New York. He tells of Muslim travellers that came to his land over one thousand years ago, and what is more important, existing evidence of legislation, treaties and resolutions that prove, beyond the shadow of a doubt that Muslims were in the Americas and very active. Although these documents have not been written after 1492, it is still interesting to note that Islam was in fact there. The Treaty of Peace and Friendship of 1787 have the signatures of Abdel-Khak and Mohammed Bin Abdulla. According to a federal court case from the Continental Congress,

Native Muslims helped put life into the constitution.

These are a matter of record; they cannot be disputed. Go to the National Archives or the Library of Congress and see for yourself; the Treat of 1987 show that the Natives abided by an Islamic system in commerce, maritime shipping and government. The records of the State of Carolina has the Moors Sundry Act of 1790. The Cherokee Chief of 1866 was a man called Ramadhan Bin Wati. Native clothing up until 1832 was full Islamic wear.
http://www.themodernreligion.com/ht...e-columbus.html

variant 13 · 12-30-2003, 10:29 AM

Quote:

The Treaty of Peace and Friendship of 1787 have the signatures of Abdel-Khak and Mohammed Bin Abdulla. According to a federal court case from the Continental Congress,

I believe LadyShea answered this point:

Quote:

Originally posted by LadyShea
I linked you to those treaties, care to demonstrate from the treaties themselves, how this conclusion was drawn? The Peace and Friendship treaty was with Morocco, of course the signers were Muslims.

beanpie · 12-30-2003, 11:29 AM

Quote:

how this conclusion was drawn?

what "conclusion", was that? and please, don't suggest that I "figure it out".

Quote:

The Peace and Friendship treaty was with Morocco, of course the signers were Muslims.

THE AUTHOR NEVER STATED, THEY WERE NOT!

variant 13 · 12-30-2003, 11:45 AM

From: http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/di...y/bar1786t.htm

Quote:

This is a Treaty of Peace and Friendship established between us and the United States of America, which is confirmed, and which we have ordered to be written in this Book and sealed with our Royal Seal at our Court of Morocco on the twenty fifth day of the blessed Month of Shaban, in the Year One thousand two hundred, trusting in God it will remain permanent.

Beanpie calm down I refered back to previous post, on the second page of this thread.

variant 13 · 12-30-2003, 11:51 AM

Quote:

MOROCCO AND THE U. S .A
In 1787, Morocco became the first nation to recognize the newly independent United States of America. A letter was addressed By the Sultan Sidi Mohamed Ben Abdallah to George Washington to tell him that he had instructed his naval vessels to respect and protect the ships of the American colonies. After the American Revolution, the United States concluded a Treaty of Peace and Friendship with Morocco, still in effect today, which makes it the longest standing unbroken treaty that the United States has had with any nation.

THE POLITICAL SYSTEM
The Kingdom of Morocco is an Islamic, Democratic and Social Constitutional Monarchy.

I got this from: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/African_Stu...co_review.html

Which would mean that the signitaries (sp???) from Morocco were more than likely Muslims.

beanpie · 12-30-2003, 01:00 PM

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
how this conclusion was drawn?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

what "conclusion", was that?

variant 13 · 12-30-2003, 01:24 PM

That was from the quote of a post by LadyShea, from page two.

But I see you have ignored everything else in my last few posts.

mb · 12-30-2003, 02:11 PM

Tallahassee is the Creek Indian word for a town. There are many place names in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, and Oklahoma derived from it.

From Tallahassee To Tulsa: Creek Place-Names in the American South Jack B. Martin, College of William and Mary, 2002

Creek Language Archive

beanpie · 12-30-2003, 02:15 PM

Please, forgive my inability, to understand. Let us begin, again, shall we?

Jmebob quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Treaty of Peace and Friendship of 1787 have the signatures of Abdel-Khak and Mohammed Bin Abdulla. According to a federal court case from the Continental Congress,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I believe LadyShea answered this point:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by LadyShea
I linked you to those treaties, care to demonstrate from the treaties themselves, how this conclusion was drawn? The Peace and Friendship treaty was with Morocco, of course the signers were Muslims.

Now, what point,exactly, do you wish to make?

12-30-2003, 02:11 PM	#109
mb Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 13	Tallahassee Tallahassee is the Creek Indian word for a town. There are many place names in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, and Oklahoma derived from it. From Tallahassee To Tulsa: Creek Place-Names in the American South Jack B. Martin, College of William and Mary, 2002 Creek Language Archive

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12-30-2003, 09:42 AM	#102
beanpie Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: voston Posts: 699	On the second voyage Columbus took to the West Indies, the people of Haiti told him that "black" people had been there before him. They showed him spears of these visitors, and further study of the metals involved in their construction showed that they could have been made only in one place: Guinea. But let us say that we are wrong. Perhaps it is all just a coincidence; after all, there are no living survivors of the Native American Muslims, are they? Wrong. And this last part is what originally drew me into this quest for knowledge: an expos� written by a Native Muslim. Brother Mahir Abdal-Razzaaq El wrote in his account, recently posted on the Internet, about the Native Americans that were Muslims. He is of the Cherokee tribe; known as Eagle Sun Walker, and a Pipe Carrier Warrior of the Cherokees in New York. He tells of Muslim travellers that came to his land over one thousand years ago, and what is more important, existing evidence of legislation, treaties and resolutions that prove, beyond the shadow of a doubt that Muslims were in the Americas and very active. Although these documents have not been written after 1492, it is still interesting to note that Islam was in fact there. The Treaty of Peace and Friendship of 1787 have the signatures of Abdel-Khak and Mohammed Bin Abdulla. According to a federal court case from the Continental Congress, Native Muslims helped put life into the constitution. These are a matter of record; they cannot be disputed. Go to the National Archives or the Library of Congress and see for yourself; the Treat of 1987 show that the Natives abided by an Islamic system in commerce, maritime shipping and government. The records of the State of Carolina has the Moors Sundry Act of 1790. The Cherokee Chief of 1866 was a man called Ramadhan Bin Wati. Native clothing up until 1832 was full Islamic wear. http://www.themodernreligion.com/ht...e-columbus.html

12-30-2003, 01:00 PM	#107
beanpie Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: voston Posts: 699	quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- how this conclusion was drawn? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- what "conclusion", was that?

12-30-2003, 01:24 PM	#108
variant 13 Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: no where, uk Posts: 4,677	That was from the quote of a post by LadyShea, from page two. But I see you have ignored everything else in my last few posts.

12-30-2003, 02:15 PM	#110
beanpie Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: voston Posts: 699	Please, forgive my inability, to understand. Let us begin, again, shall we? Jmebob quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Treaty of Peace and Friendship of 1787 have the signatures of Abdel-Khak and Mohammed Bin Abdulla. According to a federal court case from the Continental Congress, -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I believe LadyShea answered this point: quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by LadyShea I linked you to those treaties, care to demonstrate from the treaties themselves, how this conclusion was drawn? The Peace and Friendship treaty was with Morocco, of course the signers were Muslims. Now, what point,exactly, do you wish to make?

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