Freethought & Rationalism Archive

foxjazz · 12-30-2003, 01:21 AM

First off: To say "God only exists as a concept" is a belief.
To say "God exists as a material being" is also a belief.

Seeing how one can only posit God to exist honestly only if there is evidence for it (not finding that knowedge by faith, but by verifyable, repeatable emperical evidence).

My standards of honesty, and integrity are higher than that of wishful thinking, or faith thinking.

However to say that one can only arise to the belief that God exist by faith, can be an honest statement. It all depends on where you draw the line on the standard of how knowledge is acquired and where we put that in our world view.

Fox

Jeffrey Formosa · 12-30-2003, 02:06 AM

Atheists are arrogant but so are Christians and every type of person who believes that there afterlife or god/gods/no-gods are better and more believeable, to not be arrogant you must not think your beliefs are 100% right and not talk about your beliefs. Atheists are just as bad if not worse then Christian.

DBT · 12-30-2003, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrey Formosa
Atheists are arrogant but so are Christians and every type of person who believes that there afterlife or god/gods/no-gods are better and more believeable, to not be arrogant you must not think your beliefs are 100% right and not talk about your beliefs. Atheists are just as bad if not worse then Christian.

Belief or non belief is irellevent if there was any decent evidence for the existence of God anybody with half a brain would accept it.
Do away with personal bias/faith/belief and learn to see the world as it truly is.
Where is the evidence for Gods existence?

spacer1 · 12-30-2003, 03:30 AM

i believe the difference may lie in the nature of atheists and theists. I may be over-generalizing, but I believe that most atheists are generally sceptical by nature, whereas theism requires faith - the opposite of scepticism.

Edited to add: This is not to judge either as being "right". I believe that a little of both can be healthy.

Jeffrey Formosa · 12-30-2003, 03:36 AM

Still Atheists are the sameas Atheists and Christians both preach fear, gods may be unlogic but are afterlifes, hell is no only unlogic afterlife.

DBT · 12-30-2003, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by spacer1
i believe the difference may lie in the nature of atheists and theists. I may be over-generalizing, but I believe that most atheists are generally sceptical by nature, whereas theism requires faith - the opposite of scepticism.

Edited to add: This is not to judge either as being "right". I believe that a little of both can be healthy.

There is a very good reason why theism requires faith,
a complete lack of evidence.
with faith you accept fantasy as being the same as fact.
It's the worst kind of self deception.

spacer1 · 12-30-2003, 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DBT:
with faith you accept fantasy as being the same as fact.
It's the worst kind of self deception.

It's lucky we have you here to help us differentiate the fantasy from the facts.

DBT · 12-30-2003, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by spacer1
It's lucky we have you here to help us differentiate the fantasy from the facts.

From reading these threads I felt somebody had to do it
Oh the pain.

Jeffrey Formosa · 12-30-2003, 04:16 AM

Atheism needs faith to, if you believe in any thing that hasn't got 100% proof then it is faith.

DBT · 12-30-2003, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrey Formosa
Atheism needs faith to, if you believe in any thing that hasn't got 100% proof then it is faith.

Do you need faith that the stars exist? the sun?the earth?
reality needs no faith.
reality needs no belief.
only fantasy requires faith.

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12-30-2003, 01:21 AM	#21
foxjazz Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Denver Posts: 54	First off: To say "God only exists as a concept" is a belief. To say "God exists as a material being" is also a belief. Seeing how one can only posit God to exist honestly only if there is evidence for it (not finding that knowedge by faith, but by verifyable, repeatable emperical evidence). My standards of honesty, and integrity are higher than that of wishful thinking, or faith thinking. However to say that one can only arise to the belief that God exist by faith, can be an honest statement. It all depends on where you draw the line on the standard of how knowledge is acquired and where we put that in our world view. Fox

12-30-2003, 02:06 AM	#22
Jeffrey Formosa Banned Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 261	Atheists are arrogant but so are Christians and every type of person who believes that there afterlife or god/gods/no-gods are better and more believeable, to not be arrogant you must not think your beliefs are 100% right and not talk about your beliefs. Atheists are just as bad if not worse then Christian.

12-30-2003, 03:30 AM	#24
spacer1 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 564	i believe the difference may lie in the nature of atheists and theists. I may be over-generalizing, but I believe that most atheists are generally sceptical by nature, whereas theism requires faith - the opposite of scepticism. Edited to add: This is not to judge either as being "right". I believe that a little of both can be healthy.

12-30-2003, 03:36 AM	#25
Jeffrey Formosa Banned Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 261	Still Atheists are the sameas Atheists and Christians both preach fear, gods may be unlogic but are afterlifes, hell is no only unlogic afterlife.

12-30-2003, 04:16 AM	#29
Jeffrey Formosa Banned Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 261	Atheism needs faith to, if you believe in any thing that hasn't got 100% proof then it is faith.

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