Larsguy47

What do you think "high sabbath" versus simply "sabbath" means? There is more than one kind of "sabbath", that is a day of rest. For instance, the day of atonement is called a SABBATH at Lev 23

26 And Jehovah spoke further to Moses, saying: 27 “However, on the tenth of this seventh month is the day of atonement. A holy convention should take place for YOU, and YOU must afflict YOUR souls and present an offering made by fire to Jehovah. 28 And YOU must do no sort of work on this very day, because it is a day of atonement to make atonement for YOU before Jehovah YOUR God; 29 because every soul that will not be afflicted on this very day must be cut off from his people. 30 As for any soul that will do any sort of work on this very day, I must destroy that soul from among his people. 31 YOU must do no sort of work. It is a statute to time indefinite for YOUR generations in all places where YOU dwell. 32 It is a SABBATH of complete rest for YOU, and YOU must afflict YOUR souls on the ninth of the month in the evening. From evening to evening YOU should observe YOUR SABBATH.”

Thus, again, two special "sabbath" days, days of rest, are associated with PASSOVER, the 1st and the 7th day of this convention week. No work was to be done on the 15th or the 21st. But as no work was to be done on these special sabbaths, these "high sabbaths", it meant it was preceeded by a day of preparation as any other sabbath. The two sabbaths of passover thus had to "preparations for passover". Thus John 19:14 in making reference to just before "preparation for passover" is addressing one of the two preparation for passover days, either the 14th or the 21st. Since Jesus couldn't eat the the customary passover until after preparation was over at sunset of the 14th, which began the sabbath day of the 15th, the only other reference for the day of "preparation for passover" is the 20th. But again, John uses "but preparation" rather than just "preparation" and thus indicates this is "yet" or just before preparation and thus the noon before preparation would begin that evening. It's sort of the time of day like we say in the "afternoon" period, theirs was "before the next day" period of the day.

So there is no confusion here with Passover and Sabbath. But by Jesus' time, Passover was not simply the Seder, but referred to the entire 8-day festival which was also exchangeable with the "festival of unfermented cakes."

As far as eating the Seder, Christ said to keep this in remembrance of him until he returned. He would eat it one last time and then there's no need to celebrate it any more to remember when he left 2000 years ago, right? So, no, being among those who believe Christ has returned, it is no longer a required ceremony. Of course, for those who just want to celebrate Passover as a Jewish holiday, I suppose that's okay. Did you have lamb?

I do like matzah ball soup though!

LG47

RED DAVE

From Larsguy47:
Wrong.

You claim to be the Messiah, a Jew, but you didn't have a Seder. Tsk. Tsk.

More evidence that you're a false Messiah.

RED DAVE

Larsguy47

It's not about me but about the ending of the Passover significance when Jesus died, and the establishment of the Lord's Supper for Christians. They were to keep it as an annual celebration until he returned. When he did, then that would end that.

This is part of the prophecy about ending "gift and sacrifice" at MID-70TH WEEK found in Daniel. I won't go into explaining it but will just tell you the basics, which is the messiah arrives during the 70th week of a 490-year period, the 70th week being a 7-year period. This happens TWICE, each with the first and second coming.

Each time a manner of "ending gift and sacrifice" occurs. The first time at Jesus' death he ends the significance of the ritual animal sacrifices, he being the fulfillment of that. But he establishes another form of "gift and sacrifice" celebration via the annual Lord's Supper. It is to be kept by his disciples annually until he arrives. When he does, then he eats it one more time and then that ends that form of gift and sacrifice. But this happens at MID-70TH-WEEK PASSOVER. Therefore, this would point to within the first year the messiah would arrive since his first passover meal must be the mid-70th week passover.

The 70th week during the 1st coming was 29-33-36 CE. Counting down 4 70-week periods from 36CE, a period of 1960 years, the 70th week ending in our day near the time of the second coming is 1989-1993-1996. So Christ would not appear before passover of 1992 but not after passover of 1993.

So based upon the 1947 fulfillment of the 1290 days, where November 30th is when the Partition agreement took place, you have just a 4-month window for the appearance of the messiah, between November 30, 1992 and April 6 (Passover) 1993.

Of TRIVIA note. The sign of the son of man appeared after that event took place between December 24-26, 1992. Thus each time Jesus became flesh and took up a human form it was near th winter solstice. That is, if the ANNUNCIATION (when mary was told she would become pregnant) occurred around December 25th, then the messiah would be born 9 months later around the time of the autumnal equinox, which in 2 BCE was very close in line with the Festival of Booths. Therefore, the special 8th day "high sabbath" is considered to be the date of Jesus' circumcision to fulfill the 8th day, by which we can pinpoint Jesus' actual birthdate to September 13-14, 2 BCE.

Interesting that the messiah takes up the flesh around the time of the "birth of the sun" perhaps suggesting why he is called the "Bright morning star" and thus he is represented in the solar system as the sun, and the church, beautiful, but dependent upon the light of the sun to shine, is the Moon.

Wonderful!

I'm going to recheck the Redshift specifics for 2 BCE and post it to see how close the soltice and equinox were that year in terms of the lunar cycle!

LG47

Doug Shaver

My Jewish friend to whom I referred in a previous post informs me: "There was always only one Sabbath."

Steven Avery

Hi Doug,

Even in traditional Judaism there are distinctions made between the creation/exodus 7th-day sabbath and other sabbaths that are associated with the days of YHVH (which would include the 'high sabbath'). One example is that the prohibition on "no work" can vary in intensity based on a difference in the Tanach text.

The context of your friends comment may be a bit different.

Shalom,
Steven Avery

dongiovanni1976x

100% correct

dongiovanni1976x

e.g. "Holy Convocations" (Exodus 12:16; Leviticus 23:7)

dongiovanni1976x

How do we "know" this was not the day of preparation?

If we look at each Gospel historically in their own context and not start with the assumption that they are in harmony it is obvious that John wants to say that Jesus is dying as the lambs are being sacrificed for the Passover meal. It is the only Gospel to make such a reference and it makes the story all the more powerful. He is the sacrificial lamb in John, whereas in the synoptics Jesus eats the Passover meal with his disciples. The reason this meal is not in John is because Jesus is the main course.

Doug Shaver

Can you cite a Jewish source for that claim?

Or for the claim that "convocation" is another word for "sabbath"?

Cege

Isaiah 1 (NIV) lists sabbaths and convocations in a way that would seem to distinguish them as two different gatherings:

13 Stop bringing meaningless offerings!
Your incense is detestable to me.
New Moons, Sabbaths and convocations—
I cannot bear your evil assemblies.

14 Your New Moon festivals and your appointed feasts
my soul hates.
They have become a burden to me;
I am weary of bearing them.

Maybe someone with a knowledge of the Hebrew will enlighten us.