Freethought & Rationalism Archive

mikey1987 · 03-11-2005, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

My burden is for you, but after hearing this evidence, if you choose to reject it, it is because you want to go to hell. Jesus said that even if He returned right this second to stand before you, you would still not believe Him. How truly this is. What a guy! What a God!

Oh oh now its personal. If I go to hell, I'm haunting your family for the next 1000 years with Satan as my helper. Prove me wrong now. It's unlikely I will go to this fictional place you call Hell, but if I'm there I'll make the most outta it.

Have you even considered the possibility of merit in other religions? You slash Mohammed even though he has done you no harm; are you not guilty of the same act you criticize Mohammed for? Hypocrite.

I've heard plenty of Muslims assure me Allah was the True God. After reading the Koran, I've concluded it has the same merit as the Bible - worthless. All just a bunch of fiction. Creative fiction though, I must admit

Chris Weimer · 03-11-2005, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

Actually, that is not correct. We come here knowing full well we can not convert you to Christ because we realize that is a choice you have to make, we can't make it for you.

Though, like a person crossing a road about to be hit by a truck it is incumbent upon us to do all we can to help you from killing yourself, or in other words, spending at eternity in hell cognizant of your eternal separation from God forever.

:rolling: :thumbs: So my choices are what again? Live a LIE or live for the TRUTH. I've chosen TRUTH <edited>

GoodLittleAtheist · 03-11-2005, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

The difference between Muslims and Christianity is that the former was written by a pedophile pirate killer in a cave while Christianity is founded on 4000 years of facts, and Jesus died for those facts of spiritual reality.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

I was the same as you before I was saved. You might be able to see why you need to believe this which is due to your being pompous.

My recommendation to you is to improve your reading skills, then you might be able to read better to understand what I wrote to you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

Righteously God has to put you in hell because He loves His children. He loves His sons and daughters so much that He will never let you near them for eternity. That is true love. Therefore, God keeps you eternally separated from Him and us. Praise the Lord! That is justice and righteousness.

Wow. You're so over the top that you may actually push believers into our camp. :thumbs:

Chris Weimer · 03-11-2005, 09:16 PM

Your case for supernatural?

Quote:

1. Why is eternally evolving biologically or non-biologically wrong, that is, in its more encompassing meaning? Simply stated, if for eternity things have been evolving (biologically or non-biologically), by this very definition of evolving, you would have had an eternity to be perfected irrespective of when you personally started in the evolving chain. The assumption that it has always been going on in the past of eternity (many cosmologists and evolutionists believe this, biologically or non-biologically as they have told me so), therefore, then, what must follow, is that you have also had an eternity to be perfected and since you are not, this proves that such evolving eternally of the past is incorrect. We can see in just a few short years from 6000 years ago since the first Adamic man that we have changed and matured in leaps and bounds and that it will not need another 6000 years to be perfected. The pre-endemic, pre-adamic period is considered the "dust" of the ground (Gen. 2.7). It will do nothing for your spirit and your life in Christ for it can not explain initial cause, and that is where it will always fall short of the glory of God since man can not know all God's ways

False.

Quote:

2. If an evolutionist or cosmologist or atheist or agnostic (thinly veiled atheism since a non-choice is still a rejection of God because it is not an acceptance) comes to you and says the big bang (or other natural means) is the beginning, again, that is false also since material (nature) doesn't happen all by itself. There is always a cause to the effects in nature. Material (or the smallest of particles) only knows how to react to the elements and its environment (or other small particles or waves or strings or quarks). It does not make a choice. But God does choose, and He chooses for a reason.

False, unproven assertion, false dichotomy, kind of boring too.

Quote:

3. The next trick that an evolutionist or cosmologist (as apposed to a regenerated one) or atheist or agnostic tries to pull over your eyes is through the question, "why can't God have a creator?" Easy. Because that by definition no longer makes God God. By definition God is uncreated. The subject is God uncreated, not god able to be created. I have His uncreated life in my spirit which affords me eternal life, His life. You may speak of gods or idols or other mechanisms, but debasing God has eternal consequence, since God is, by the definition of God, uncreated in speaking of God. You can not make the argument that someone or something created God since then you would no longer be speaking about God, but perhaps a god or idol or something in your imagination. We are speaking about the definition of the only God who has an eternal life, and perfect clarity, wisdom, righteousness and holiness, in His omnipotent, transcendent, omniscience immensity. He is incapable of sinning.

Argumentum ad retarded. Nothing is shown or proven.

Quote:

4. But there is yet another twist to the demented unregenerated (that I was one once) evolutionist and cosmologist's, atheist and agnostic mind that is hostile towards and independent from God. He will say "ok, so a lesser god created, so why can't he have a creator, and a creator create that creator?" This is not possible either. Why? Good question. It is because this presupposes an eternity of the past of creating gods and things and materials in causal relationship,one following after the other. This reverts us back up to #1, which if there is an eternity past of this evolving process, then you would have been perfected by now, yet you are not.

Oh look! I can call people names too! Stupid ass fecicle licking dingleberry. :down:

You've got a bunch of bullshit and nothing to back it up.

mikey1987 · 03-11-2005, 09:17 PM

oh yea by the way, it's your turn to start explaining

1 Peter 3:15

"But sanctify the Lord God in you hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear"

better start explaining yourself and your beliefs immediately. beter be nice about it too

"Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage - with great patience and careful instruction" - 2 Timothy 4:2

lets get going, you don't wanna violate your parole, aka Christianity

lvdyou · 03-11-2005, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javaman

No, you came here - you need to make the case!
Doesn't mean it's true, though. I'm pretty sure this lawyer of yours is a Christian, huh?

So he does! To bad he makes such a critical counting error in 1 Cor. 15:5 otherwise he might be more trustworthy.
Doesn't mean its not true, though. Plus, one of those older 'facts' includes one about the seed of Jeconiah which precludes Yeshua from being The Messiah. You can't even weasel out of it by claiming Joseph wasn't his real father since you need him to be.
No, those that wrote about Yeshua later may have lied. Hey! That's what we were discussing earlier! No first-hand accounts of his life!
Apparently, he alluded to being god but, for some reason, wouldn't come out and say it. He must have forgotten about being god while he was on the cross, though. Weird.
You're still threatening me and, what's worse, not trying to convince me. What have I ever done to you?

Going to bed.

He came out and said. The righteousness of God is such that He loves to see us think. He does not want to give us a cheat sheet. For example, the disciples did not understand what Jesus meant when He said "eat of my flesh, drink of my blood", so they ask Him, and He said to them, "why are you offended?" to which then walked away. Choice. Satan has got your will, don't let him. You do have a choice.

Anyway, you can see why there is a heaven and a hell because your excuses are never ending, and God cuts off the conversation eventually. By the time you are resurrected to the GWT, you will be left with nothing to say for only at that time will you finally realize once and for all you belong in hell. You will know it.

Remember, all you have is calling everyone a liar because you need to, because you are hostile to God like Satan was, whom is your father.

Paul made no counting error in 1 Cor. 15.5.

I came here, and the case is made, so since you keep making mistake after mistake, the burden lies on you.

You keep saying I am threatening you, but don't show how? That is very billigerent of you.

Nobody lied who wrote the OT and the NT books, 66 of them. They are all completely in agreement. If someone lied you would at least try to prove it instead of self-declaring pompously.

lvdyou · 03-11-2005, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikey1987

how about we play a different game. I've read Lee Strobel and the guys is guilty of nearly every fallacy in hte book. How about you read some Nietszche. Read how man has created god to fill a void and is now in the process of killing him because he is no longer needed.

And learn to spell oxymoron while you're at it

Strobel made no mistakes to speak of. You misread him.

This proves God exists,
http://www3.telus.net/trbrooks/perfectproof.htm
Therefore, Nietsche is mindless.

mikey1987 · 03-11-2005, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

Nobody lied who wrote the OT and the NT books, 66 of them. They are all completely in agreement. If someone lied you would at least try to prove it instead of self-declaring pompously.

Now you're really asking for it:

"God our Saviour; who will have all men to be saved." 1 Timothy 2:3-4

BUT

"God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned." 2 Thess. 2:11-12

Contradiction there :down:

"He shall separate himself from wine and strong drink, and shall drink no vinegar of wine, or vinegar of strong drink, neither shall he drink any liquor of grapes, nor eat moist grapes, or dried." Numbers 6:3

BUT

"And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. ... His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. ... Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim. And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it. When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine ... the governor of the feast called the bridegroom, And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now." John 3:2-10

Looks your you BOY Jesus broke a law in Numbers, and it seems the Lord drinks wine, violating his own statement in the OT. Explain that.

THERES MORE

"I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul." Leviticus 17:11

BUT

"And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins." Hebrews 10:11

Looks like your God can't make up his mind whether animal sacrifice makes him happy or not.

I have plenty more contradictions, but I think I've made my point. Your Holy Book is flawed and is contradictory unto itself

mikey1987 · 03-11-2005, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvdyou

Strobel made no mistakes to speak of. You misread him.

This proves God exists,
http://www3.telus.net/trbrooks/perfectproof.htm
Therefore, Nietsche is mindless.

Nietzsche had a mind, therefore he wasn't "mindless". I can play your game too

lvdyou · 03-11-2005, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikey1987

Oh oh now its personal. If I go to hell, I'm haunting your family for the next 1000 years with Satan as my helper. Prove me wrong now. It's unlikely I will go to this fictional place you call Hell, but if I'm there I'll make the most outta it.

Have you even considered the possibility of merit in other religions? You slash Mohammed even though he has done you no harm; are you not guilty of the same act you criticize Mohammed for? Hypocrite.

I've heard plenty of Muslims assure me Allah was the True God. After reading the Koran, I've concluded it has the same merit as the Bible - worthless. All just a bunch of fiction. Creative fiction though, I must admit

No. Rather, when you are resurrected your presence will be in another dimension that the saved will have no communication with. You are not haunting me. You can't haunt anyone when you are dead awaiting resurrection to hell from GWT. You can only haunt someone when you are alive if you want to stock someone I suppose.

I would not call making the most out of it living a life with the evil spirit in your spirit. It's more like your foretaste of hell.

I have done nothing to Mohammed except explain his hatred for God calling Jesus a liar and his writing a big book about it.

Of course you would think the Bible is fiction instread of real lives experiencing real things, spiritual things. This shows your ugliness committing the sin of bearing false witness because you hate God.

The Bible is 100% facts.

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03-11-2005, 09:17 PM	#45
mikey1987 Regular Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: CT Posts: 113	oh yea by the way, it's your turn to start explaining 1 Peter 3:15 "But sanctify the Lord God in you hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear" better start explaining yourself and your beliefs immediately. beter be nice about it too "Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage - with great patience and careful instruction" - 2 Timothy 4:2 lets get going, you don't wanna violate your parole, aka Christianity

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