hum

This article from the Sydney Morning Herald raises some interesting questions on the nature of belief. Also a bit disturbing if you take the statistics at face value..... those without a belief in God or gods seem to be a serious minority.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/...546864819.html

"First, some figures. Last year a poll found that 85 per cent of Americans believe God created the universe. In Nigeria, 98 per cent claimed always to have believed in God, while nine out of 10 Indonesians said they would die for their God or religious beliefs, says the ICM Research survey, which questioned 10,000 people.

In Ireland, 87 per cent of the population believe in God, a survey by the Market Research Bureau of Ireland found in January. Rather than rocking their faith, 19 per cent said tragedies such as the Asian tsunami, which killed 300,000 people, bolstered their belief. Polls have their faults, but if the figures are even remotely right they show the prevalence of faith in the modern world."



"So why do so many people believe? And why has belief proved so resilient as scientific progress unravels the mysteries of plagues, floods, earthquakes and our understanding of the universe? By injecting nuns with radioactive chemicals, by scanning the brains of people with epilepsy and studying naughty children, scientists are working out why. When the evidence is pieced together, it seems that evolution prepared what society later moulded: a brain to believe."

hum.

PoodleLovinPessimist

Let me just say this: I call myself a pessimist for good reason.

SLD

Well first off, 15% of the population ain't bad numbers. One, it's a lot bigger than before, especially in centuries past. Second, it represents probably the second largest single belief system in the country, behind Catholicism. Third, there's a lot more closet semi-theists out there than this poll would imply. So don't despair over the number.

Second off, I find it ludicrous to assume that we are hardwired to believe in God. We may be hardwired to conform at least in some instances, but if evolution were hard wiring our brains to believe in God, then we would be born with such a belief. Nor is there any evolutionary advantage to belief in God over non-belief in God. Just one for conformism. I just don't buy this crap.

SLD

TomboyMom

I thought this was the interesting part of the article:
That calls into question some assertions by theists about the importance of their personal subjective experience.

Betelgeuze

These 15% procent must be mostly in the big city areas.
This map also shows lower numbers. I guess it depends on how the question is asked. A couple of weeks ago the simple queston: "Do you belive in god?" was asked in several european contries. (asuming that non-abrahamic religiones were almost non-existing) I haven't found all the numbers But I know that the number of belivers here in Sweden was about 45%. Which is suprysling high. But, most people here that arn't atheist belive in "some kind of non-interfereing supernatural beeing" unconnected to the god of the bible and qur'an.

The "best numbers" were from Tjeckia were only 35 percent belived in some sort of higher beeing.

trendkill

Yes, those assertions are very much in question. Even more damaging to them is the apparent fact that simple physical stimuli can cause the brain to manufacture such experiences (see the "god helmet").

As an atheist, I believe many or most peoples' brains are predisposed to experience something that feels like a transcendent or "higher" reality under certain conditions. Of course in a heavily theistic culture this will usually be interpreted as "God", because people are a little lazy and unimaginative, frankly, and don't bother to even try to strip away the cultural context. As for there being an evolutionary advantage to it--these feelings facilitate religion, which in turn facilitates conformity and group action, which in turn can lead to the group in question having increased political and military power. The potential for an evolutionary advantage may well have been great.

Barefoot Bree

I've been thinking a lot about this subject lately, and I'm wondering if that "God feeling" might not simply be some sort of hyper-developed sense of empathy?

I have an extremely rudimentary working hypothesis of sorts. I am by no means any kind of scientist or sociologist, so this is probably a horribly laughable theory, but here goes.

I wonder if empathy developed as the means by which primitive hunter-gatherers were able to start banding together. When the first cave man thought to himself "I won't hit Og 'cause I don't like it when Og hits me", then he and Og banded together, and pretty soon started not only not hitting each other but actively looking out for each other as well. Without this elementary empathy, man would still be living as single predators.

Thus, this sense of empathy was preserved as a "beneficial mutation", because it allowed mutually-beneficial societies to develop.

Now, fast forward a few millenia, and you might have some individuals in whom that sense of empathy is hyper-developed. Add in some weird brain chemistry and certain stimuli, and you might get that heightened sense of "something or someone present but unseen" - as shown in the reports linked above.

Sound plausible?

*stands bravely waiting for the rotten tomatoes*

J-D

Which I suspect not all Anglophones will immediately recognise as the Czech Republic.

Dhaeron

So, supposedly a sample consisting of americans, nigerians, indonesian and irish is indicative for "the modern world"? I doubt this enough to call it bullshit.
If you survey most european countries i'd expect figures similar to the swedish one mentioned before. Africa and the middle east will probably have percentages like nigeria. Non-muslimic asia? I don't have a clue, but i suspect the percentage of theist won't be too high. (might be more deists there however).
Anyway that poll shows what people believe in the polled countries, but there's no way to draw any conclusions regard "the modern world" with that kind of sample population.

DBT

Here's a page on "contemporary rates and patterns of atheism"

Quote;
According to Norris and Inglehart (2004), 25% of those in Australia do not believe in God. According to Paul (2002), 24% Australians are atheist or agnostic.

Guth and Fraser (2001) found that 28% of Canadians “show no evidence of religious salience or activity.�? According to Norris and Inglehart (2004), 22% of those in Canada do not believe in God. According to Bibby (2002), when asked “Do you believe that God exists?�? 6% of Canadians answered “No, I definitely do not�? and another 13% answered, “No, I don’t think so,�? for a total of 19% being classified as either atheist or agnostic. According to Gallup and Lindsay (1999:121), 30% of Canadians do not believe in God or a “Higher Power.�?