Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Magus55 · 10-14-2003, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Demigawd
So, God, who's supposedly eternal, has a finite patience with his finite creations in regards to infinite reward or punishment. That's just a dandy mythology you got there, Magus55. All that demonstrates is the very human concept of "might makes right". Nothing holy about that at all.

Oh, and in regards to "God's children", what civilization at some point in its metaphorical life has *NOT* considered itself the chosen of God or gods? The concept that the Jews, and by proxy Christians, are the extra-special creations of this universe's creator is barbaric and ethnocentric. Again, it points to the power of "us versus them" to justify all sorts of atrocities around the world.

Jews have been known as God's chosen people since their beginning. In no other religion have I ever heard the mention of a chosen people. Not even in Islam.

Magus55 · 10-14-2003, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mageth
[B]

And I can imagine God loving everyone enough not to let anyone go to hell, or perish, or suffer on this earth "as much as needed" or in the afterlife. Isn't that more than the God you describe?

I can imagine God not letting anyone go to Hell too. But in order to do so He would have had to create us without the ability to choose right or wrong, good or evil, and then what the heck is the point of life if you can't make your own decisions? Sorry, being a robot would be Hell too.

Quote:

Then he doesn't seem to love everyone as much as you claim, if any will perish (face Hell).

Its each individuals choice of whether to follow God or not. Apparently the concept is just impossible for you to comprehend. God gave you a choice. You are either for Him, or against Him. Its that simple.

Quote:

Once again, a limit on God's suppose loving everyone "more than you can imagine."

Well its quite obvious that not everyone is gonna turn from sin and worship God ( on this board alone thats an obvious fact). So why should God prolong the suffering of those who are waiting for Him to return, just so He can sit around waiting for unbelievers to never seek forgiveness?

livius drusus · 10-14-2003, 08:34 PM

Problem of evil and the free will response again? Please y'all, have mercy on the people who actually have to read every thread in this forum and at least make some effort to keep the dicussion vaguely on topic. This one, lest we forget, is about an RR thread grooving on the idea of Israeli nuclear strikes on Syria.

Thank you,
livius drusus
Moderator, GRD

Rational BAC · 10-14-2003, 09:10 PM

Well I for one do not want nuclear strikes on any one.

Bad precedent if nothing else. You all know that within 50 years everybody and his brother will have nukes.

"A nuke here, a nuke there and pretty soon you are talking real nuclear destruction"-----------------a somewhat paraphrase of Everett Dirkson.

nermal · 10-15-2003, 03:43 AM

I especially liked this post:

Quote:

What people are saying here is that there is Bible prophecy which states "Damascus shall be made a heap of rubble". If that were to happen, MAJOR prophecy will have been fulfilled. Whether it happens because Israel makes a nuclear strike - or - God brings down fire from Heaven is conjecture. But it will happen - and it looks like it won't be long now.

Wait now, here it comes....

Quote:

Love in Christ

BWAHHHAAAAAHHHAAHAHAHAHAH!!!!

Ed

andy_d · 10-15-2003, 04:10 AM

I sometimes wonder if Christians who advocate violence and bloodshed have ever heard of that Jesus fella, let alone tried to understand his message.

I think this trustworthy news site sums it up nicely

Stephen T-B · 10-15-2003, 04:55 AM

God, wiping his hands after disembowling the Sunday-dinner goat prior to loping off its head: �Hey, son, come over here an� see the way this thing�s looking at its insides!�
Jesus, who�se in the middle of making some more Shaker furniture for the sitting room: �Look dad, how come you always act like you�re some sick bastard?�
�Bastard? Bastard! Me a bastard. That�s ripe comin� from you!�
�Hey, don�t you go on about that again! Don�t forget, I�ve spoke to my mother about how you did what you did to her when she was betrothed and all to Joseph - and know what? She said you weren�t that great anyhow. Not what she�d have expected of Mr Big!�
God pulls the goat�s head off and stuffs it into his mouth, still blinking. He swallows a few times and calls out: �Holy Spirit, stop ironing those damn robes and speak to our son, will you? He�s bein disrespectful again.�
Holy Spirit puts down the iron (it stays hot without having to be plugged in - miracles, its found, make a huge difference to the household bills). �You two at it again? Jesus, I know your Dad got a bit carried away with that Mary lass, and then had you crucified but he loves you really. We both do. And PLEASE, God, do something about those entrails before Gabriel and the others get here.�
God says: �Abracadabra!� and turns them into another goat, right there in the kitchen. Jesus sighs: �You only did that so�s you can kill it again.�
�So?�
�I don�t get it, having to kill things all the time.�
God puts his arm around him in a fatherly way: �It�s called �starting over,�� he says. �I�ve always liked �starting over.� Ask Holy Spirit. It�s what I do. Wipe out, start over, wipe out, start over. I dunno, but making things is OK, but then so is smashing them up. And well, is there any more beautiful sound than an orphan's dying scream?�
Holy Spirit starts ironing again. Jesus goes back to his lathe. God bites off the top of a Jack Daniels, empties the bottle and belches. �OK,� he says, �What�s next to kill?�

Taffer · 10-15-2003, 05:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
The sooner the end times come, the sooner God returns me to paradise and all my suffering ends.

Fixed that for you.

I wouldn't get all worked up over just another RR thread. It's nothing but people who have been given some handy bad guys to be pissed at and felt like wearing the Big Daddy Pants for kicks once. Talk is cheap.

Now, if one of them sat in front of the little red button, then I'd be scared.

Stephen T-B · 10-15-2003, 07:25 AM

...so, Magus55 can�t wait for his sufferings to end.
Is this what the Christian life has done for you - make you want to get away from all your sufferings?

Me? I like life. But then I�m a damned Atheist. I like my family, I like rock�n roll an the blues an other stuff, and having a whisky and being on my bike and being in the sun and the rain and looking at the hills and well - just being ALIVE.

If Magus can�t wait to end it all, there�s ways of arranging that without actually committing suicide, which will get him sent to hell. How about selling up, getting an airline ticket to the Middle East, sneaking into Gaza City with a tent and camping out in the vicinity of a Hamas leader?
I think the Israelis will see to it that your heart�s desire is satisfied in a day or two...

I think, Magus55, it�s a touch selfish wishing that your god would mop up humanity just so�s you don�t have to pay your bills.

Mageth · 10-15-2003, 07:34 AM

Now, if one of them sat in front of the little red button, then I'd be scared.

Do you remember a certain prominent person describing several nations as the "Axis of Evil" and promising that the War on Terrorism would not end until that evil is eliminated from the world not so long ago?

Be afraid, be very afraid.

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10-14-2003, 08:34 PM	#43
livius drusus Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Selva Oscura Posts: 4,120	Problem of evil and the free will response again? Please y'all, have mercy on the people who actually have to read every thread in this forum and at least make some effort to keep the dicussion vaguely on topic. This one, lest we forget, is about an RR thread grooving on the idea of Israeli nuclear strikes on Syria. Thank you, livius drusus Moderator, GRD

10-14-2003, 09:10 PM	#44
Rational BAC Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Tampa Bay area Posts: 3,471	Well I for one do not want nuclear strikes on any one. Bad precedent if nothing else. You all know that within 50 years everybody and his brother will have nukes. "A nuke here, a nuke there and pretty soon you are talking real nuclear destruction"-----------------a somewhat paraphrase of Everett Dirkson.

10-15-2003, 04:10 AM	#46
andy_d Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: umop apisbn Posts: 568	I sometimes wonder if Christians who advocate violence and bloodshed have ever heard of that Jesus fella, let alone tried to understand his message. I think this trustworthy news site sums it up nicely

10-15-2003, 04:55 AM	#47
Stephen T-B Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Leeds, UK Posts: 5,878	God, wiping his hands after disembowling the Sunday-dinner goat prior to loping off its head: �Hey, son, come over here an� see the way this thing�s looking at its insides!� Jesus, who�se in the middle of making some more Shaker furniture for the sitting room: �Look dad, how come you always act like you�re some sick bastard?� �Bastard? Bastard! Me a bastard. That�s ripe comin� from you!� �Hey, don�t you go on about that again! Don�t forget, I�ve spoke to my mother about how you did what you did to her when she was betrothed and all to Joseph - and know what? She said you weren�t that great anyhow. Not what she�d have expected of Mr Big!� God pulls the goat�s head off and stuffs it into his mouth, still blinking. He swallows a few times and calls out: �Holy Spirit, stop ironing those damn robes and speak to our son, will you? He�s bein disrespectful again.� Holy Spirit puts down the iron (it stays hot without having to be plugged in - miracles, its found, make a huge difference to the household bills). �You two at it again? Jesus, I know your Dad got a bit carried away with that Mary lass, and then had you crucified but he loves you really. We both do. And PLEASE, God, do something about those entrails before Gabriel and the others get here.� God says: �Abracadabra!� and turns them into another goat, right there in the kitchen. Jesus sighs: �You only did that so�s you can kill it again.� �So?� �I don�t get it, having to kill things all the time.� God puts his arm around him in a fatherly way: �It�s called �starting over,�� he says. �I�ve always liked �starting over.� Ask Holy Spirit. It�s what I do. Wipe out, start over, wipe out, start over. I dunno, but making things is OK, but then so is smashing them up. And well, is there any more beautiful sound than an orphan's dying scream?� Holy Spirit starts ironing again. Jesus goes back to his lathe. God bites off the top of a Jack Daniels, empties the bottle and belches. �OK,� he says, �What�s next to kill?�

10-15-2003, 07:25 AM	#49
Stephen T-B Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Leeds, UK Posts: 5,878	...so, Magus55 can�t wait for his sufferings to end. Is this what the Christian life has done for you - make you want to get away from all your sufferings? Me? I like life. But then I�m a damned Atheist. I like my family, I like rock�n roll an the blues an other stuff, and having a whisky and being on my bike and being in the sun and the rain and looking at the hills and well - just being ALIVE. If Magus can�t wait to end it all, there�s ways of arranging that without actually committing suicide, which will get him sent to hell. How about selling up, getting an airline ticket to the Middle East, sneaking into Gaza City with a tent and camping out in the vicinity of a Hamas leader? I think the Israelis will see to it that your heart�s desire is satisfied in a day or two... I think, Magus55, it�s a touch selfish wishing that your god would mop up humanity just so�s you don�t have to pay your bills.

10-15-2003, 07:34 AM	#50
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	Now, if one of them sat in front of the little red button, then I'd be scared. Do you remember a certain prominent person describing several nations as the "Axis of Evil" and promising that the War on Terrorism would not end until that evil is eliminated from the world not so long ago? Be afraid, be very afraid.

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